Update on Client Permissions.

[misik]

its kind of funny, how everyone demonize the staff, while cheering up for Shane, who is the one because of nobody can play. ok, he had all rights to do that but why? because of that stupid and ridiculous privacy stuff (in every mmo they spy on you, do not be naive, dear Shane).

what I have understood from all of this is fact, Shane is pooping on players, who simply wants to play (this great and addictive game) because of his personal f**** with pwo staff, while knowing that getting a new client isnt a simple thing.
on the other hand, staff should really seriously thing about apologize him and discuss temporary using his client to let us play and develop or finish that so much needed new client or this game will die in weeks or months, if you will be lucky.

people hate waiting and personally, i have experienced too many endings because of the same thing - immature behavior and staffs personal problems, to wait for another tragic fall of next mmo game server.

i really want to hope, that both sides are not so stupid and stubborn but... :/
what we, the players need, is info about current situation, how long does it take or if you even tried to contact Shane or hows the developing continue and if we have to search for another game or not.

thanks for reading...

 

[HitmonFonty]

If there is any chance of a temporary solution to let players play until the new client is completed Xanatus would have considered it. Either way if you can be patient for a little longer we are preparing a plan and will have more news to share in the next week or two when it is finalised.

 

[matileo19]

its kind of funny, how everyone demonize the staff, while cheering up for Shane, who is the one because of nobody can play. ok, he had all rights to do that but why? because of that stupid and ridiculous privacy stuff (in every mmo they spy on you, do not be naive, dear Shane).

what I have understood from all of this is fact, Shane is pooping on players, who simply wants to play (this great and addictive game) because of his personal f**** with pwo staff, while knowing that getting a new client isnt a simple thing.
on the other hand, staff should really seriously thing about apologize him and discuss temporary using his client to let us play and develop or finish that so much needed new client or this game will die in weeks or months, if you will be lucky.

people hate waiting and personally, i have experienced too many endings because of the same thing - immature behavior and staffs personal problems, to wait for another tragic fall of next mmo game server.

i really want to hope, that both sides are not so stupid and stubborn but... :/
what we, the players need, is info about current situation, how long does it take or if you even tried to contact Shane or hows the developing continue and if we have to search for another game or not.

thanks for reading...

Shane ???? The staff ???

Who is Xanatus ? How many money are they getting from donations per month ? Please answerme, do some calcs.

 

[Mortyh]

I really tried to not involve me here, but some things are unacceptable.

First: Yeah, All people should know that in every online game (or most of them at least), staff member can check your private messages. How do you think that a report can be made? Just with prints? Prints can be violated with a simple edit and staff members need to have account access to check some reports for example. Shane as a encoder know this "absurd spying. Oh my God!".
Second: Compare these actions with government actions is ridiculous because you can't measure international system and the interests before it. Every state has your own hegemony, laws and a entire complex world so much different than a simple mmo game. I can't believe that someone arises a question like this.
Third: PWO generates so much money and "hallelujah" for this. Now what? You'll came with that argument to prove what? It's really sad to say any financial word here. Every people here also should know that like any mmo game, you can make a donation. Problems are real for any staff, but showing financial questions as a way to get some false reason to prove that this game MUST be online always is a tragic and child action.

As a complement, we already passed for other crisis, this isn't the first and won't be the last. So please, blablabla "let's find" another Pokémon game, if you can't wait some weeks to play again something that you like, well.. What we've got here is a more complex question, a psychological one. Let's wait patiently guys.

Thanks for your reading and thank you staff to trying put the game online back. We are always hoping news.

Best Regards,
Mortyh.

 

[LeroyGarcia]

Duplicate post...

 

[Lunesta]

I really tried to not involve me here, but some things are unacceptable.

First: Yeah, All people should know that in every online game (or most of them at least), staff member can check your private messages. How do you think that a report can be made? Just with prints? Prints can be violated with a simple edit and staff members need to have account access to check some reports for example. Shane as a encoder know this "absurd spying. Oh my God!".
Second: Compare these actions with government actions is ridiculous because you can't measure international system and the interests before it. Every state has your own hegemony, laws and a entire complex world so much different than a simple mmo game. I can't believe that someone arises a question like this.
Third: PWO generates so much money and "hallelujah" for this. Now what? You'll came with that argument to prove what? It's really sad to say any financial word here. Every people here also should know that like any mmo game, you can make a donation. Problems are real for any staff, but showing financial questions as a way to get some false reason to prove that this game MUST be online always is a tragic and child action.

As a complement, we already passed for other crisis, this isn't the first and won't be the last. So please, blablabla "let's find" another Pokémon game, if you can't wait some weeks to play again something that you like, well.. What we've got here is a more complex question, a psychological one. Let's wait patiently guys.

Thanks for your reading and thank you staff to trying put the game online back. We are always hoping news.

Best Regards,
Mortyh.

I wish there was a "thanks/like/etc" button.

 

[janellie11]

Days pass by ..
PWO is still out ..
.
.
Well, sleep again :3

 

[LeroyGarcia]

its kind of funny, how everyone demonize the staff, while cheering up for Shane, who is the one because of nobody can play. ok, he had all rights to do that but why? because of that stupid and ridiculous privacy stuff (in every mmo they spy on you, do not be naive, dear Shane).

what I have understood from all of this is fact, Shane is pooping on players, who simply wants to play (this great and addictive game) because of his personal f**** with pwo staff, while knowing that getting a new client isnt a simple thing.
on the other hand, staff should really seriously thing about apologize him and discuss temporary using his client to let us play and develop or finish that so much needed new client or this game will die in weeks or months, if you will be lucky.

people hate waiting and personally, i have experienced too many endings because of the same thing - immature behavior and staffs personal problems, to wait for another tragic fall of next mmo game server.

i really want to hope, that both sides are not so stupid and stubborn but... :/
what we, the players need, is info about current situation, how long does it take or if you even tried to contact Shane or hows the developing continue and if we have to search for another game or not.

thanks for reading...

Shane ???? The staff ???

Who is Xanatus ? How many money are they getting from donations per month ? Please answerme, do some calcs.

Yeah I am really intrigued as to where the donations are going....Is pwo receiving a little, just enough, or more than needed to maintain the game and reward the staff? Everytime an overflow of money comes about the staff could get greedy and even begin to break apart from fights between members.

My point is that I understood the [Big Favor] the staff were doing us by providing us with the game by sacrificing their time and resources. Now this charity scenario which I am grateful for, can easily turn tables once substantial profits start to come about. At this point, people who have spent a good amount on the game have all the rights to have detailed information about the current evolution of the current issue and how the staff is working the issues out. After all, if the game is as profitable as I can imagine then the game will be back sooner or later since a normal person won't just pack its cash cow and move on would they?

I know what the whole "donations" thing is about but I feel it has now turned into a business. But like I said, I don't know the numbers so I am only making an assumption. I don't even know the amount of active players before the game went down which could be helpful.

 

[knotzl02]

what I have understood from all of this is fact, Shane is pooping on players, who simply wants to play (this great and addictive game) because of his personal f**** with pwo staff, while knowing that getting a new client isnt a simple thing.
on the other hand, staff should really seriously thing about apologize him and discuss temporary using his client to let us play and develop or finish that so much needed new client or this game will die in weeks or months, if you will be lucky.

Would you want your client to be used in an illegal game?

The development of new client while the old client is off old IS NOT A SOLUTION

Apparently it is the ONLY solution

 

[Merse]

1) Shane has every right to demand the client not to be used any more for PWO.
2) This could be a good thing, if POW staff can actually muster up a brand new client which they know and which they can develop further.
3) Blame falls heavily (but not entirely!) on PWO staff for letting the situation escalate into this.
4) Violation of user privacy cannot be tolerated and PWO staff abused its rights as moderators. There must be consequences of this, and some leaders must seriously consider if they still think themselves suitable for being head admin or whatever title they may have. Changes in the highest ranks of PWO staff is inevitable.
5) Although he is ot legally obliged to do so, Shane should allow the game to keep run with his client for a predetermined time, until the new client becomes available. This time shouldn't be shorter than 1 month and shouldn't be longer than a year.
5) The scenario detailed above would have my total support.

Step 1 would be, if the staff wants to move forward with spying on people, make a Privacy Policy, and let players be aware of whats really going on.

Step 2, like you said, is to change the name from Private Messaging, to say something like just Message.

Bis is actually right here. My only issue about the whole situation is that PWO staff is not obliged in any way to use the information they may obtain discretely and diligently. What if some hacker approaches Lee and asks for bank account information in exchange for $100.000? Who could stop him form selling those data? We're putting way more faith into the goodwill of PWO staff than some of them would deserve by allowing them to manually register donations and by not being able to see how much money flows into PWO and what happens to that money. And now they can violate my private life on PWO as well without any warning or without any monitoring body to watch them what they actually do? This is too much to ask.
The PWO privacy policy doesn't cover access to personal data and so monitoring PMs without the knowledge of the subjects is a harsh violation of every civil code, and a violation of PWO's Privacy Policy.

 

[Merse]

About the money: There were some discussions about that. Several server provider was checked for prices and then those data were compared with the known donations. There were months when ONE SINGLE DONATOR provided enough money to keep the game up and running for that month. Although we have no solid proof, it is most likely that PWO is a rather.... lucrative establishment. Hopefully that's a strong enough reason not to let it fall.
By the way, I'm not against it if the game keeps running and getting updated. I consider it like a patent or like a musical piece. Once you made it, you can get a steady stream of influx from it for the rest of your life, and that's all good and well. Again, as long as the game is being updated regularly.
But a more transparent budget of PWO would be welcome. Then again it could cause some legal issues...

 

[janellie11]

[glow=purple]Hello PWO staffs,[/glow]

~ [glow=green]I strongly recommend to bring back the game A.S.A.P because a lot of players already lost the interest in playing the game due to the time that passed. The more time to get the game running again, the more loss for pwo. Especially the Newbie donators that just played lately before this incident. I also recommend that Xanatus should talk to Shane personally and sort a way to make the game running again using the old client. While the new PWO client is being prepared. Im telling you this behalf of my cousins, friends and other players who really loves the game.[/glow]


[glow=yellow]Loyal Player,[/glow]
janellie11


[glow=blue]P.S[/glow]
~ [glow=red]Following your pride doesn't really helps to solve anything.[/glow]

 

[BRGodEastwood]

its kind of funny, how everyone demonize the staff, while cheering up for Shane, who is the one because of nobody can play. ok, he had all rights to do that but why? because of that stupid and ridiculous privacy stuff (in every mmo they spy on you, do not be naive, dear Shane).

what I have understood from all of this is fact, Shane is pooping on players, who simply wants to play (this great and addictive game) because of his personal f**** with pwo staff, while knowing that getting a new client isnt a simple thing.
on the other hand, staff should really seriously thing about apologize him and discuss temporary using his client to let us play and develop or finish that so much needed new client or this game will die in weeks or months, if you will be lucky.

people hate waiting and personally, i have experienced too many endings because of the same thing - immature behavior and staffs personal problems, to wait for another tragic fall of next mmo game server.

i really want to hope, that both sides are not so stupid and stubborn but... :/
what we, the players need, is info about current situation, how long does it take or if you even tried to contact Shane or hows the developing continue and if we have to search for another game or not.

thanks for reading...

Shane ???? The staff ???

Who is Xanatus ? How many money are they getting from donations per month ? Please answerme, do some calcs.

Yeah I am really intrigued as to where the donations are going....Is pwo receiving a little, just enough, or more than needed to maintain the game and reward the staff? Everytime an overflow of money comes about the staff could get greedy and even begin to break apart from fights between members.

My point is that I understood the [Big Favor] the staff were doing us by providing us with the game by sacrificing their time and resources. Now this charity scenario which I am grateful for, can easily turn tables once substantial profits start to come about. At this point, people who have spent a good amount on the game have all the rights to have detailed information about the current evolution of the current issue and how the staff is working the issues out. After all, if the game is as profitable as I can imagine then the game will be back sooner or later since a normal person won't just pack its cash cow and move on would they?

I know what the whole "donations" thing is about but I feel it has now turned into a business. But like I said, I don't know the numbers so I am only making an assumption. I don't even know the amount of active players before the game went down which could be helpful.

PWO is worth at least 40grand USD. The only people who even touch anything donation based, are Bluerise, and Xanatus bank account. If anyone is getting paid off, its those two. The rest of staff (me being one for 5 years I can answer this) never received any sort of compensation. Now if that has changed, and Bluerise is funding his fellow british staff, I do not know. But there are never infighting among staff for donations. The biggest compensation arguement ever held during my time as staff, was me asking for a legendary on my player account as compensation for the work I had done up until that point (which would then later transition to legendaries being handed out to certain people who hit certain quotas, for instance, a lets say a mew or something for someone who has x amount of maps placed in game, celebii for whoever has x amount of music in game, mewtwo for whoever hits x amount of bans, one of the fighting legendaries for anyone who hit x amount of battles on, etc). No matter how much I dislike the people in staff for turning on me and jock riding bluerise just because hes admin, even though I had most of them promoted (wheres the loyalty right?) they would never have arguments over donations.

HOWEVER, there are a lot of donations that go unaccounted for, once the bills are paid. What is done with those donations, I do not know.

 

[Sylpharionz]

Problems come and go everyday, what's unacceptable is the time taken to address each and every problem. There should be a clear roadmap, timeline and deadline to everything (yes everything), and not just saying "we're in the middle of thinking up something". That's like going to a car service center and they give you a vague answer like "who knows, maybe tomorrow, maybe next week, maybe never... I'll fix it when I feel like it." Every meeting has to have a conclusion and not create even more delay. As of now what I can see is that the entire staff (yes entire) is pretty much lacking in this professionalism aspect. Real life has real deadline, no matter you can deliver it or not, put your neck on the line for it and not just dilly dally waiting for a miracle to happen (the miracle here is somehow Xan has something to say about it, so we're gonna wait for him forever?).

tl;dr version: staffs never have real job before, otherwise they would know how to handle problems better.

 

[mad30]

For a game being so 'lucrative' the owners who are the only ones that actually has any ownership of the money (for however long or w/e purpose) DO NOT GIVE A S*** ABOUT THIS GAME.

How often do you see xan?
How much support has shane given this game?
Shane gets into 1 fight with the staff, runs away. Gets into a second fight shuts it down.

The othermembers of the staff do not see any money, which is part of the reason they don't provide that much content because the incentive is not there to make as much content as you want, only as much as they want to put in the effort to make.

If I was making 10+ grand off this game or however much I would make sure I keep players and staff happy so they would donate more and the game wouldn't die. Or at the very least put the correct people in place to manage the game and not just say "meh do w/e just bug me when the physical server is down or donations are having issues"

In summary, owners suck or they don't actually make money.

 

[BRGodEastwood]

For a game being so 'lucrative' the owners who are the only ones that actually has any ownership of the money (for however long or w/e purpose) DO NOT GIVE A S*** ABOUT THIS GAME.

How often do you see xan?
How much support has shane given this game?
Shane gets into 1 fight with the staff, runs away. Gets into a second fight shuts it down.

The othermembers of the staff do not see any money, which is part of the reason they don't provide that much content because the incentive is not there to make as much content as you want, only as much as they want to put in the effort to make.

If I was making 10+ grand off this game or however much I would make sure I keep players and staff happy so they would donate more and the game wouldn't die. Or at the very least put the correct people in place to manage the game and not just say "meh do w/e just bug me when the physical server is down or donations are having issues"

In summary, owners suck or they don't actually make money.

Judging by how Shane gets overruled at every step, doesn't get treated by staff as an owner, and actually hasn't gotten a whiff of the donations since like 2009, (leading xan to be the sole "owner" of PWO, since the donations go to his bank account), ownership sucks. From the convo I've had with Xan, Xan is complacent with everything going on right now progression wise, and pretty much is behind anything Bluerise does because Bluerise doesn't bug him for things.

an excerpt of a convo I had with xan 2 months ago about potential changes to PWO. http://prntscr.com/4ldf02


EDIT: looks like i was way off with 40grand usd. Apparently I was told according to token stores sales info given by bluerise, PWO made $200,000 usd in 2013.

 

[xellos15]

For a game being so 'lucrative' the owners who are the only ones that actually has any ownership of the money (for however long or w/e purpose) DO NOT GIVE A S*** ABOUT THIS GAME.

How often do you see xan?
How much support has shane given this game?
Shane gets into 1 fight with the staff, runs away. Gets into a second fight shuts it down.

The othermembers of the staff do not see any money, which is part of the reason they don't provide that much content because the incentive is not there to make as much content as you want, only as much as they want to put in the effort to make.

If I was making 10+ grand off this game or however much I would make sure I keep players and staff happy so they would donate more and the game wouldn't die. Or at the very least put the correct people in place to manage the game and not just say "meh do w/e just bug me when the physical server is down or donations are having issues"

In summary, owners suck or they don't actually make money.

+1

 

[mad30]

For a game being so 'lucrative' the owners who are the only ones that actually has any ownership of the money (for however long or w/e purpose) DO NOT GIVE A S*** ABOUT THIS GAME.

How often do you see xan?
How much support has shane given this game?
Shane gets into 1 fight with the staff, runs away. Gets into a second fight shuts it down.

The othermembers of the staff do not see any money, which is part of the reason they don't provide that much content because the incentive is not there to make as much content as you want, only as much as they want to put in the effort to make.

If I was making 10+ grand off this game or however much I would make sure I keep players and staff happy so they would donate more and the game wouldn't die. Or at the very least put the correct people in place to manage the game and not just say "meh do w/e just bug me when the physical server is down or donations are having issues"

In summary, owners suck or they don't actually make money.

Judging by how Shane gets overruled at every step, doesn't get treated by staff as an owner, and actually hasn't gotten a whiff of the donations since like 2009, (leading xan to be the sole "owner" of PWO, since the donations go to his bank account), ownership sucks. From the convo I've had with Xan, Xan is complacent with everything going on right now progression wise, and pretty much is behind anything Bluerise does because Bluerise doesn't bug him for things.

an excerpt of a convo I had with xan 2 months ago about potential changes to PWO. http://prntscr.com/4ldf02

It was rather disgraceful that the staff didn't treat shane with more respect considering he is a part owner, and not his fault he wasn't able to full fill these duties for most of the time he was away. Only issue I have with shane was that he was bullied away, YES BULLIED, when he came back and did try to full fill those duties and instead of standing ground gave up so easily and became a bully himself.

xan on the other hand is spineless.

Quote me on that. How the hell would he know how much 'fans' are enjoying it when he never interacts with them. He's the major part of the problem we don't have progress, it's the ownership duties to higher high position staff and managers (devs, admins)

 

[angelking89]

i shall put my head into IRC and sit tight ...

 

[Merse]

Consider this: Xan (and most likely Blue) have a healthy influx of money on a daily basis for what... 5 years now? And they have to do nothing for it. For years, Xan is not even around, still he benefits from PWO donations. I could imagine how comfortable that could be. I'm not surprised he lost track of how things are going. It's just feels too good to gain a monthly salary from something while your... let's say, friend keeps the show running.
It also explains how could Blue still be a head admin. While he is by far the most unpopular staff member, he is the one who Xan can trust.