Tecknician come take a look pls

[DarkCyrus]

The current issue of this topic isn't whether or not to limit status boost to 3 or 4 stage increases/reductions. The problem Kpyppo introduced is going back and forth with moves like growl vs. Dragon dance, or featherdance vs swords dance. Recently people are even spamming moves like agility in order to have their opponent kill them as to not be boosted on, and the opponent refusing to kill the poke in order to boost the next pokemon. I could easily boost on a pokemon with 3-4 atk stages of atk depletion, so these battles of stubbornness will continue regardless. PP during PVP would really be the best option if TM's or B&W 2 moves are not on the table.

yeah now i got it even with 3-4 stages is enough to keep doing the same thing, we need a better solution!! TMs or update to B&W 2 moveset seems to be the best option though hmm , will we get what we want?? , im afraid PWO wasnt rdy yet to get this stat changing moves implemented ingame :/

 

[HitmonFonty]

yeah now i got it even with 3-4 stages is enough to keep doing the same thing, we need a better solution!! TMs or update to B&W 2 moveset seems to be the best option though hmm , will we get what we want?? , im afraid PWO wasnt rdy yet to get this stat changing moves implemented ingame :/

What Teck said is that is the best that can be done currently, or it will effect server stability. So I suggest you stay on topic and decide whether restricting stat changing moves to 3 or 4 times each per battle (or their effectiveness at least)- and it wouldn't hurt to make a list of those moves also I'm sure it would help in the work Teck will have to do if it is decided to go ahead with this.

 

[DarkCyrus]

yeah now i got it even with 3-4 stages is enough to keep doing the same thing, we need a better solution!! TMs or update to B&W 2 moveset seems to be the best option though hmm , will we get what we want?? , im afraid PWO wasnt rdy yet to get this stat changing moves implemented ingame :/

What Teck said is that is the best that can be done currently, or it will effect server stability. So I suggest you stay on topic and decide whether restricting stat changing moves to 3 or 4 times each per battle (or their effectiveness at least)- and it wouldn't hurt to make a list of those moves also I'm sure it would help in the work Teck will have to do if it is decided to go ahead with this.

up to teck as said lets see what he/she has in mind, and about the moveset list, Creobis made a topic asking for suggestion on improving the battle system, although im not sure if teck looked the topic nor Creobis did something after players gave their lists

 

[HitmonFonty]

I meant to make a list of the moves to limit- dragon dance, agility, growl etc, so that it is clear which need to be done.

 

[HOF69]

Only just saw this topic, so I'd like to clarify what exactly happened in my battle that KP described. I had Swampert out, and LukeWar brought in his Dragonite. Anyone that battles in PWO knows that Swampert doesn't stand even a remote chance of beating Dragonite, so naturally the best option for me was to use Growl a couple of times to lower Dragonite's attack, thus setting up my next Pokemon nicely without worrying about taking too much damage from Dragonite. However, as many others have tried to do in the past, Luke tried spamming Dragon Dance, hoping that I would eventually give up using Growl (I didn't) so that he could boost his Dragonite so much that it would be unbeatable. Basically, had I used any other move besides Growl, it would have been as good as a forfeit in that battle. This back-and-forth of Growl and Dragon Dance went on for nearly 30 minutes!

Of course, this is just an example of the boosting problems presented in PWO right now. As others have noted in this topic, a strategy rapidly growing in popularity is to lower the attack stat of a Pokemon that is likely to only have physical moves (such as Snorlax), and then bringing in Dragonite or Scizor to boost itself with Agility and Dragon Dance or Swords Dance to the point where that Pokemon can sweep an entire team. There are ways to avoid this problem, but I won't get into that discussion. The point is that the back-and-forth scenarios of moves like Growl and Dragon/Swords Dance or Scary Face and Agility for what seems like an eternity is getting ridiculous.

As has also been noted by other players, TMs could help to solve this problem. However, PP is likely the most logical solution. Then again, I don't recommend PP for every move, as one of the best advantages of PWO is being able to train indefinitely without having to return to a Pokecenter just to restore PP. I do agree with Fonty's idea of limiting certain moves, namely all stat changing ones (e.g. Agility, Dragon Dance, etc.). I don't see the need for PP on attacking moves or status moves (i.e. sleep, confusion, etc.) until switching is fixed. Sure, players could still get stuck in back-and-forth situations, but at least you'd know they have a defined end point (when one player runs out of PP). I'll try and list the moves that right now should have the PP they get in the handhelds or similar:

Dragon Dance
Swords Dance
Agility
Scary Face
Featherdance
Memento
Growl
Belly Drum
Curse
Autotomize
Rock Polish

 

[LanceDM]

Lol... you both clearly showed that you have nothing to do besides pwo :B.

Question for Teck/Lee:

A new client is needed? (for the following updates):

- PPs
- TMs
- Switching allowed and fixed

Wich update may* come first ?

EDIT: Talking about the 3 I mentioned, not others.

 

[Tecknician]

- PP, Probably will need a client update.
- TM's, No need for client update.
- Switching, No need for client update. May need complete battle system overall.

Which will come first? *Throws a dart at the dartboard divided into sectors with the 3 options*

 

[Dragon16]

- PP, Probably will need a client update.
- TM's, No need for client update.
- Switching, No need for client update. May need complete battle system overall.

Which will come first? *Throws a dart at the dartboard divided into sectors with the 3 options*

i would choose, well i dont want to be greedy.... all of the above!!!
Or the easiest and fastest choice would probably be helpful.

 

[PhantomsCV]

How about everything that is "stage" related, would have a limit of uses (PP type thing) per Pokemon, per battle. If you can only go 4 stages, you can only do it 4 times then it says, "No longer available" if you try to use it. Or it "misses" when you try to growl / Dragon Dance. If it can go 4 stages, you can do the move 4 times total (even if it doesn't change anything) then the accuracy drops to 0% and it misses every time

 

[EcoWOLFrb]

- PP, Probably will need a client update.
- TM's, No need for client update.
- Switching, No need for client update. May need complete battle system overall.

Which will come first? *Throws a dart at the dartboard divided into sectors with the 3 options*

well right now people just have to adapt if PP isn't an option. It'd probably be too drastic to consider placing rules for PVP about wars of patience. Tm's don't seem to be on their way any quicker than a new client (not that I'm complaining about volunteer work being slow), and switching without a complete battle system would be relentlessly aggravating and would only cause more complaints. Regardless of which action you take if any at all, we still appreciate any consideration on the matter.

 

[The-Predator]

I am not complaining... everything was okay in the battles, however there are always missing points, and these "battlers" somehow found the way to take advantage, (they think they doing strategy, but they dont understand that it shouldnt be happening and abusing on spamming some moves). I am not asking for TMs implemented nor moveset update (Teck said theres no need for client update, wondering.. theres someone working on TMs already??, will they ever be implementing TMs, if they ready.. what are u waiting for implement em in game?).
I am just asking for a solution for it, battles are becoming really annoying and ridiculous, if u dont want to do anything to solve it, then we cannot do anything about it and we could simply stop battling although im not a hunter nor a collector but I simply enjoy log in into my account to train some pokemon and battle then PWO wouldnt be that funny anymore and i could just stop playing PWO (I know i wont be missed)

 

[Tecknician]

There are several issues with implementing PP:
First if it was done without a client update, you wouldn't know how many uses you have left and out of how many.
Secondly the possibility of having issues having the user choose a different move if he doesn't have any uses left may be a challenge. Which just shows the state of the server. This should be a laughably easy thing to do, but with pwo, the simplest things makes me want to paint the way of metal parts.

With tm's we have several obstacles in the way as well. While a bit more possible without a client update, still rather difficult. This includes selecting the tm you want to use, and mainly stating what pokemon you want to learn the move. The next part, checking the pokemon can learn the move and if not, while possible require a fair amoung of coding involved, which, is a risky issue with the state the server is in. Most of the modifications I have done so far have been extremely minor. Adding tm is not a minor deal. It's like taking a log cabin and adding electricity. Seeing how the walls are made of logs instead of a hallow plaster wires will be exposed. Possibly causing some major damage if an accident takes place.

 

[ksalim313]

I don't know if it was discussed before or not, but for the TM part, why should we simulate the original games while we're having too many issues; I mean, why can't we use the TMs the same way we edit our pokemon moves, consider this:

We can click on the pokemon we want to teach a certain TM in the gallary of the "My pokemon" section of playerdex, when the pop-up window appears, it has a link "Add TM moves" after the "Edit moves" link.
When a player enters the new section, he/she will see the linked page divided into two sections; the first section will have the 4 moves currently learnt by the pokemon and the second section will have all available TMs for this pokemon. Of course the player will have to select in total 4 moves, and the price calculations may vary from one TM to another but since the TM move itself will not be available for second use, the price of each TM shall be well studied beforehand.

The main idea is to teach TM for each pokemon the same way the pokemon can re-learn a move.

 

[The-Predator]

There are several issues with implementing PP:
First if it was done without a client update, you wouldn't know how many uses you have left and out of how many.
Secondly the possibility of having issues having the user choose a different move if he doesn't have any uses left may be a challenge. Which just shows the state of the server. This should be a laughably easy thing to do, but with pwo, the simplest things makes me want to paint the way of metal parts.

With tm's we have several obstacles in the way as well. While a bit more possible without a client update, still rather difficult. This includes selecting the tm you want to use, and mainly stating what pokemon you want to learn the move. The next part, checking the pokemon can learn the move and if not, while possible require a fair amoung of coding involved, which, is a risky issue with the state the server is in. Most of the modifications I have done so far have been extremely minor. Adding tm is not a minor deal. It's like taking a log cabin and adding electricity. Seeing how the walls are made of logs instead of a hallow plaster wires will be exposed. Possibly causing some major damage if an accident takes place.

I do understand how much work needs to be done for TMs but is anyone working on this project already?? or they arent coming anytime soon??

wondering wouldn´t be easier to update movesets to B&W 2?? or this is not possible atm??

 

[The-Predator]

I don't know if it was discussed before or not, but for the TM part, why should we simulate the original games while we're having too many issues; I mean, why can't we use the TMs the same way we edit our pokemon moves, consider this:

We can click on the pokemon we want to teach a certain TM in the gallary of the "My pokemon" section of playerdex, when the pop-up window appears, it has a link "Add TM moves" after the "Edit moves" link.
When a player enters the new section, he/she will see the linked page divided into two sections; the first section will have the 4 moves currently learnt by the pokemon and the second section will have all available TMs for this pokemon. Of course the player will have to select in total 4 moves, and the price calculations may vary from one TM to another but since the TM move itself will not be available for second use, the price of each TM shall be well studied beforehand.

The main idea is to teach TM for each pokemon the same way the pokemon can re-learn a move.

I think the best way would be to add TMs to the token store and buying em as usual like with other items/pokemon

 

[Orean]

I think the best way would be to add TMs to the token store and buying em as usual like with other items/pokemon

Regardless of the fashion TMs are implemented in, it's optimal that the "pay-to-win" X-factor is made minimal. TMs most likely will be made obtainable without requiring the exchange of tokens.

wondering wouldn´t be easier to update movesets to B&W 2?? or this is not possible atm??

This is easily possible via database changes; exactly how all Pokemon movesets were updated to B/W earlier this year, from what I've researched. However, whether it's an opportune time or not for this update, compared to changes that have yet to be made to the actual battle-system engine, is another question—in the context of balancing out the battle system to the player's desires.

 

[ksalim313]

In my humble opinion, I think both who can and cannot use the token store (not all players have the luxury to donate and some of them don't have Paypal operational in their countries) and such advancement in the game has to be shared fairly.

I'm trying to think of a solution or temporary solution that does not require addition or modification in the server side coding; adding more code to the server that may contain hidden bugs, may result in piling old bugs and new bugs which will definitely affect the server's stability and may drive us to a point where we will need to recreate some sub-systems in PWO.

What I thought of may not be the best solution (it was just a wild idea) but since it requires only webpage interface and database transactions, it may be helpful to balance the current system and address the issue in hand without waiting for more bugs in the current code.

Updating the moveset of all pokemon to B2/W2 or even adding the missing B/W moves may be a good idea since it will create a new recipe for battles.

 

[Tecknician]

wondering wouldn´t be easier to update movesets to B&W 2?? or this is not possible atm??

It would be easy to update to b/w moveset. But I won't why? Simple: Players are greedy. Not even a week after I updated them to B/W I was being begged by way too many people to update them again. I'm personally tired of hearing about this so until I stop seeing this suggested EVERY DAMN DAY it won't happen.

 

[Tecknician]

Which part of the switching bug needs to be fixed before it can "help" this issue?

 

[andrewle]

i was battling with someone and i was beating him (dont want to say the name) and then he said i should stop switching because no one likes it LOL so i stop switching then i lose, now i think the game is not the only one to be changed for the better but as well as the mentality of the players that are playing the game but sadly there's nothing we can do about it.