Not sure what everyone expects staff to do at this point, I have to wonder if anyone is getting anything besides a slap on the wrist for this, but then again that wouldn't help much considering all the back lash that they're receiving. Hopefully PWO staff will learn to grow from this and not have such a biased hive mind and will continue to move forward with development and actively seek out new DEV's.
We an point fingers all day, we can carefully measure how much guilt each side has in this situation, but it won't solve the crucial problem of PWO.
We have a development staff which
- was proven completely unable to do any major updates to the game due various reasons (redesigning existing things like reworking the spawns is is nice, but I would hardly call it an extension tot he game)
- has no in-depth knowledge about the client or the server code (hence being cut-off from the possibility of ever making any major update)
- has worse than mediocre communication skills and an unacceptable towards the players and apparently within the team as well (with a few exceptions).
And then we had Shane who is not only the owner of this game but also the only one who could make some real updates. I could imagine that some staff members were jealous of him (even if they wouldn't admit it) because he just returned, accomplished more in a few weeks than they did in the last two years and obviously he became incredibly popular in an instant. Maybe I would be irritated in their place as well, they were working years to accomplish something and Shane comes in and does the same in a week.
But the point is that PWO desperately needs Shane. He is the last one who has enough knowledge about the code to keep this game alive. I seriously doubt that this community has two more years without any major updates (which are impossible without Shane) to wait for some new hotshot developer to write a new client from scratch. Especially if you consider how tedious and frustrating it could be to work on such a huge project alone. No wonder Hardcoreh couldn't make it.
I can accept that Shane has an attitude and he should communicate more with the rest of the staff, but in my opinion the game and the staff is in no situation to chase him away. In fact I think Blue should go and beg him to come back at least that long so he could teach the code of the game to someone else.
I think this is the time when the fate of PWO will be decided. We'll see if Creon's hubris is too much to allow Antigone to bury his father. I leave it to the staff to decide who is who in the drama
For once I wasn't attacking anyone and was doing my best to remain calm. But I hadn't slept for 36 hours at that point and everyone just made me irritated then I realized I was being a jackass and tried to apologize. Mantis is slowly becoming a more tolerant person
There are tons of opinions being thrown around but I would just like to say Im 100% with the post mad made on page one explaining how both sides are to blame. He sums it up in my mind pretty perfectly.
We had made the change without even realizing it would even effect him, and as a result we failed to inform him. In hindsight, we should have done so regardless of if we expected it to affect him or not.
Admission of their failure to adequately communicate with shane.
Creobis said:
Once staff was able to piece together what had happened, we were able to find where our fault was in all of this - that we should have been more encouraging toward Shane in joining group discussion and that we should have established a reliable, low-maintenance team-based communication route early on. During a meeting with Xanatus, we informed him that we would welcome Shane back and fully include him in our team’s business, as we should have done from the start. Sadly this declaration may have come too late, and it is unfortunate for all of PWO that we had to discover our mistakes in this way.
Acknowledgement of their faults, and evidence of them attempting to learn from their mistakes almost immediately, and acting upon those mistakes to try to make them right.
Creobis said:
We also hope that over time there may be forgiveness between everyone involved, and ask that everyone be given time to heal and learn from what has transpired.
Honest appeal to your common decency as people (which you apparently might not have), to stop beating a dead horse.
Creobis said:
We wish Shane success with his future and other projects, and we apologize to him both for the misunderstandings and how greatly the situation has escalated.
Public apology, swallowing pride, foregoing any remnant of disagreeable feelings towards to other side of this conflict.
With ALL this, it still isn't good enough for you vultures? You still feel the need to harp on the staff for their human mistakes? Are you a pack of wolves, seeing an injured animal and going for the throat? Jesus, everyone makes mistakes, everyone has been in a situation they wish they could change after the fact, there's nothing you can do but rise above it and learn from it. As long as they do indeed learn from it, there's no reason for me to carry resentment or ill feelings for the current staff, but some of you people seem downright hateful, and you need to get over yourselves.
You know, I'm sure there could have been a greater effort from shane to get involved with their community, but I don't see a lot of you people even acknowledging that there were mistakes on both sides. You think shane is some perfect little angel who was overtaken by the flaws of the other staff like a tidal wave on a village? You must see the world in a funny light.
Maybe you guys should take a step back, and a deep breath before you post any more hate. I'm literally feeling physically ill because of some of these revolting, extremist comments. I won't say any names but my opinion on some of you really changed by your immature reactions throughout the last few days, and whats funny is you probably don't even realize it, you're just bandwagon jumpers who have a hard time thinking for yourselves.
In closing, I'll just say that OBVIOUSLY... there were many mistakes made here, and yes, most of them probably were made by the staff. I'm sure things were said in the heat of the moment that shouldn't have, but I'm not so closed minded to think it completely one sided either. Stop throwing tantrums like a child withheld of candy, and the horse isn't even bleeding anymore for god's sake.
Shane made more progress in two months than staff did in years
staff are political/clique/childish
shane is owner he can do what he wants
democracy voting for staff (you've all proven that'd be a horrible idea)
Biased crap about bis from his friends
biased crap about bluerise from bis' friends
All staff being lazy (you really don't know what you're talking about)
Just read up on what happened, being an old player it's sad to see such a legendary figure such as Shane(in my time..) depart after consideration of my return, I hope he is able to come back to this project after seeing the work he put in while I was present, he was definitely a great asset to this community
Also not sure why people are talking smack about Bis, lol guy's a chill dude
We had made the change without even realizing it would even effect him, and as a result we failed to inform him. In hindsight, we should have done so regardless of if we expected it to affect him or not.
Admission of their failure to adequately communicate with shane.
Creobis said:
Once staff was able to piece together what had happened, we were able to find where our fault was in all of this - that we should have been more encouraging toward Shane in joining group discussion and that we should have established a reliable, low-maintenance team-based communication route early on. During a meeting with Xanatus, we informed him that we would welcome Shane back and fully include him in our team’s business, as we should have done from the start. Sadly this declaration may have come too late, and it is unfortunate for all of PWO that we had to discover our mistakes in this way.
Acknowledgement of their faults, and evidence of them attempting to learn from their mistakes almost immediately, and acting upon those mistakes to try to make them right.
Creobis said:
We also hope that over time there may be forgiveness between everyone involved, and ask that everyone be given time to heal and learn from what has transpired.
Honest appeal to your common decency as people (which you apparently might not have), to stop beating a dead horse.
Creobis said:
We wish Shane success with his future and other projects, and we apologize to him both for the misunderstandings and how greatly the situation has escalated.
Public apology, swallowing pride, foregoing any remnant of disagreeable feelings towards to other side of this conflict.
With ALL this, it still isn't good enough for you vultures? You still feel the need to harp on the staff for their human mistakes? Are you a pack of wolves, seeing an injured animal and going for the throat? Jesus, everyone makes mistakes, everyone has been in a situation they wish they could change after the fact, there's nothing you can do but rise above it and learn from it. As long as they do indeed learn from it, there's no reason for me to carry resentment or ill feelings for the current staff, but some of you people seem downright hateful, and you need to get over yourselves.
You know, I'm sure there could have been a greater effort from shane to get involved with their community, but I don't see a lot of you people even acknowledging that there were mistakes on both sides. You think shane is some perfect little angel who was overtaken by the flaws of the other staff like a tidal wave on a village? You must see the world in a funny light.
Maybe you guys should take a step back, and a deep breath before you post any more hate. I'm literally feeling physically ill because of some of these revolting, extremist comments. I won't say any names but my opinion on some of you really changed by your immature reactions throughout the last few days, and whats funny is you probably don't even realize it, you're just bandwagon jumpers who have a hard time thinking for yourselves.
In closing, I'll just say that OBVIOUSLY... there were many mistakes made here, and yes, most of them probably were made by the staff. I'm sure things were said in the heat of the moment that shouldn't have, but I'm not so closed minded to think it completely one sided either. Stop throwing tantrums like a child withheld of candy, and the horse isn't even bleeding anymore for god's sake.
Shane made more progress in two months than staff did in years
staff are political/clique/childish
shane is owner he can do what he wants
democracy voting for staff (you've all proven that'd be a horrible idea)
Biased crap about bis from his friends
biased crap about bluerise from bis' friends
All staff being lazy (you really don't know what you're talking about)
Diff points of views from both sides Eco, and there's truth in both sides, the truth offends, isn't there a phrase that says that the truth offends ?
Democracy... You and me, we have 2 points of view, you're supporting more 1 side than the other (consciously or unconsciously) and its not like that you're wrong or right, its just that you have a way to see things and I have other, which is a good convination in a staff group and the current one doesn't have it... I know it.
Mantis mentined something about how ''democracy'' may work in pwo and he gave us a good idea, something that may be implemented to change a bit how pwo is running right now.
Diff points of views from both sides Eco, and there's truth in both sides, the truth offends, isn't there a phrase that says that the truth offends ?
Democracy... You and me, we have 2 points of view, you're supporting more 1 side than the other (consciously or unconsciously) and its not like that you're wrong or right, its just that you have a way to see things and I have other, which is a good convination in a staff group and the current one doesn't have it... I know it.
Mantis mentined something about how ''democracy'' may work in pwo and he gave us a good idea, something that may be implemented to change a bit how pwo is running right now.
I think you mean "The truth hurts" but that's neither here nor there. I'm actually not as one sided as you might think mati, and none of the problems that went on between shane or the staff is what I'm peeved with. I accept that mistakes were made, mistakes will always be made no matter which scenario you're in, what annoys me is the lack of understanding.
I don't mind people picking one side or another based on the information they were given. I don't mind them expressing their opinions, in fact I encourage it! I just don't like how viciously people are attacking one particular side, especially after this kind of public statement and admission of fault. At the beginning of this post, it was like people in the old country throwing fruit at a criminal on the way to the execution, it's unnecessary. I would like to see a more civilized approach to the controversy.
When it comes to the democracy, the fact is that some of the sensitive information that is kept from the PWO public shouldn't be released, and in order for any sort of democratic process to occur, I think the PWO public would need to be properly informed before making some decisions, and it's just not practical. I believe in this situation PWO would easily be ran into the ground, which is why the staff try to keep an eye on suggestions and discussions on the forums, so they can incorporate players' perspectives into their own discussions. Believe me, there are good people on staff who legitimately care about your opinions and feedback, just remember all those discussions with teck we've had on forums, why else would he have put in the time to do so if he didn't care?
Dude, spare me. All of a sudden you and a few others have gone soft ever since Creobis released a statement that was ever so heart felt and sincere but we know the true intention behind that facade. There is no way anyone can blame Shane because he did more than the entire staff combined could in one month. And he did it all on his own. Now because I said something like that, it'll be deemed as a one sided bashing, which I don't care as to how you perceive it.
You could see that Shane was even busy with a new client GUI look as provided by Fadoka_1 and the youtube video. PWO was headed to a brighter tomorrow and if some assholish staff didn't do what they always do, which is to act like stuck up *****es with pride issues, this game would have been absolutely amazing. And brennan or whoever, I don't care if I get a forum ban. You people need to stop acting like kings and queens and realize what a fine minority you are.
This can refer to either side, going to need you to be specific as to who you are talking about. I mean names, emails, phone numbers, the last time you hide in their closet etc.
Also, you failed to inform me you was back, this makes me angry.
Dude, spare me. All of a sudden you and a few others have gone soft ever since Creobis released a statement that was ever so heart felt and sincere but we know the true intention behind that facade. There is no way anyone can blame Shane because he did more than the entire staff combined could in one month. And he did it all on his own. Now because I said something like that, it'll be deemed as a one sided bashing, which I don't care as to how you perceive it.
one month, lolz..
these all staff coudn't do that in 3-4 years since Shane left, he did that in one month..!!!!! hahaha no comparison in intelligence and talent.!!!
These staff can only show powers and pride..!!!
This can refer to either side, going to need you to be specific as to who you are talking about. I mean names, emails, phone numbers, the last time you hide in their closet etc.
Also, you failed to inform me you was back, this makes me angry.
I thought I was being specific enough. Not my fault if you missed the specifics. I'm certainly not going to help you along, smart one. Also, i'm not back. Don't mistake my replying to forum posts as me playing on the client. Now that a top contributive DEV is gone, this game will go to **** and no publically released statement will help with that
