PWO's Economy.

[Franc92]

Personally i think that in these days, more than in others (i play only from 8 months so far, so i can't speak for the past) is very hard to sell pokes.
My personal opinion is that a lot of skilled player that had a considerable ammount of money are banned (Thank you Brennan for your amazing job), and others are just busy in their real life that can't play Pwo. An other point to my little "talk" is about the token store pokemons, that are connected strightly with the economy of the game.
Many new players that have starting the game recently were selling tokens for 1.5-2m each so that litteraly is destroying the system of economy in this game. Plus shiny bouns is something that I HATE because TSS pokemons have not very good ivs at all and they can be sold for 100m+. Now, if those people of are selling tokens for example sell them for 4m+ (they have all to do that, or it is useless) and if we wait 2-3 months and also the botters start to be less and less, it will be a fair game for all. I personally feel satisfy when i found an HR with quite good ivs and sell it at a fair price. At the end there a little suggestion for the Token Store pokemon : New UC's (maybe 4th gen? ) and no shiny bonus anymore (or only shiny bonus of those pokes that can't be founded wild in game). Just a little personal discussion, feel free to read it when you have time.

 

[Alpha_Kai]

Well I don't know about that but I think its just fine for people have a chance to get shiny's with tokens, It's a fair exchange to be able to have advantages in exchange for sponsoring the games advancement. Besides, the market always evolves to compensate.

 

[Franc92]

Well dude, i speak also for a sense of frustration. I have spent over 150+ tokens all to ger Uc's with the shiny bonus and not get one, then the first newby at his first try (he is a friend of mine) got his S Uc as a result of incredible luck. I want to think that is fair if it happen in game, to find Shiny rare, Vrare, and Hrare, but not in this way. I'm just wondering what will happen to the game if nobody won't donate anymore.

 

[Saurus]

Well dude, i speak also for a sense of frustration. I have spent over 150+ tokens all to ger Uc's with the shiny bonus and not get one, then the first newby at his first try (he is a friend of mine) got his S Uc as a result of incredible luck. I want to think that is fair if it happen in game, to find Shiny rare, Vrare, and Hrare, but not in this way. I'm just wondering what will happen to the game if nobody won't donate anymore.

Lmao. I can concur with your frustration. It really is a bummer. It's like you played the lotto for years and suddenly your buddy comes along and tries his luck and becomes 100 million dollars richer.

 

[Franc92]

Well dude, i speak also for a sense of frustration. I have spent over 150+ tokens all to ger Uc's with the shiny bonus and not get one, then the first newby at his first try (he is a friend of mine) got his S Uc as a result of incredible luck. I want to think that is fair if it happen in game, to find Shiny rare, Vrare, and Hrare, but not in this way. I'm just wondering what will happen to the game if nobody won't donate anymore.

Lmao. I can concur with your frustration. It really is a bummer. It's like you played the lotto for years and suddenly your buddy comes along and tries his luck and becomes 100 million dollars richer.

Yes, exactely like that.

 

[stoopkid1]

couldn't agree more with you franc. on the subject of "donating to the games advancement", i find that a bit hard to believe. if donations stopped today, the game wouldn't come offline due to insufficient funds for a server. this community has been around for 7+ years (i originally played back in 2005), and the economy of PWO reflects that. it's tough to sell, in my opinion, because most of the poke for sale aren't worth much anymore, whether they're shiny or not. unless this game has "limits" to how many of a specific pokemon there are in-game (whether UC or Wild), eventually all pokemon would lose their value. that's why IVs are such an integral part of the marketplace.

 

[Tecknician]

So random thought:
What if we were to increase the likelihood of getting a TS shiny pokemon or even outright get one, but remove the shiny bonus completely?

 

[Franc92]

So random thought:
What if we were to increase the likelihood of getting a TS shiny pokemon or even outright get one, but remove the shiny bonus completely?

I would completely agree with this. It would be kinda less "frustrating" and more "fair" for everyone that take TS pokemons.

 

[rainbowromper]

Personally i think that in these days, more than in others (i play only from 8 months so far, so i can't speak for the past) is very hard to sell pokes.
My personal opinion is that a lot of skilled player that had a considerable ammount of money are banned (Thank you Brennan for your amazing job), and others are just busy in their real life that can't play Pwo. An other point to my little "talk" is about the token store pokemons, that are connected strightly with the economy of the game.
Many new players that have starting the game recently were selling tokens for 1.5-2m each so that litteraly is destroying the system of economy in this game. Plus shiny bouns is something that I HATE because TSS pokemons have not very good ivs at all and they can be sold for 100m+. Now, if those people of are selling tokens for example sell them for 4m+ (they have all to do that, or it is useless) and if we wait 2-3 months and also the botters start to be less and less, it will be a fair game for all. I personally feel satisfy when i found an HR with quite good ivs and sell it at a fair price. At the end there a little suggestion for the Token Store pokemon : New UC's (maybe 4th gen? ) and no shiny bonus anymore (or only shiny bonus of those pokes that can't be founded wild in game). Just a little personal discussion, feel free to read it when you have time.

How will this work exactly? People already don't want to pay for token pokes. I spend $15 dollars on a Beldum. So the in game value would be 30m (according to your 2m/token value). That is for a random beldum, it could be complete trash. Most likely, unless it is an amazing beldum, I am only going to get between 2-12m for it, IF I can sell it at all. So currently I'm not getting even half of what I am spending on it. You think increasing the cost of token will do anything if we already can't get their worth for the pokes? Especially since you propose doubling it. And yet again, you complain about how token store shinies can have bad ivs and be sold for 100m+. If you essentially double their cost what do you think is going to happen to their price? And since you are complaining that there isn't enough money in game, how is that going to help. Additionally, almost everything regarding the Token Store is absurd. The prices are ridiculous. Staff at PWO have set the value of 2 Beldums, two ingame pokes that could be horrible and worthless, equal to the value of a REAL Pokemon game. And the cheapest are almost the same as a month subscription of Netflix. There is supposed to be a 7% chance of getting a shiny from the token store. According to PWO released stats, only 1% of bonus purchases yielded a shiny. This a huge difference. And removing pokes from in game and making them available only via token store is just trying to get people to spend more money in the token store. Also, since PWO was so kind as to release stats, it is easy to figure out a decent estimate of how much PWO took in last year. And unless PWO is spending 10k/month on the crappy servers they use, there is serious money missing. And since the updates we get are always small and take forever, we can assume that's not what the money is going towards.

 

[mhanth4f]

Finnally someone talking about economy.








INFLATION!

 

[Franc92]

My simple point of view is: i prefer to buy pokes from token store personally, than buy tokens. I have tryied boths. I spent over 190 real $ and not got neither a satisfaction. In the other way trying to resell those pokes doesen't fits with the money is spent in real world, so my conclusion is the high difference between tokens and real money. I think the best solution will be or to put new pokes in the store, or to lower their cost in terms of tokens: For example: 3 tokens for a prisme scale is an absurdity. While at the same time 15 tokens for a beldum is high too. If they lower their price to 1-2 tokens per pokemons, it will be a bit better. Also will benefit the economy of the game in terms of quantity of Uc's inside.

 

[Julio~]

It's really hard to sell pokémons right now than before. I would like to make only 2 points I've heard over there:

• Before there were large amounts of hack money and regarding this, prices were raised up.

• Before players seemed to buy any pokémon but now I guess they are more linked to the battle scene and IVs. (just my opnion)

 

[DaSnowman]

Finnally someone talking about economy.

INFLATION!

First of all inflation would mean there is a surplus of money so it loses value and things would go up in price which i can assure you there is not

So i have been around pwo since 2011 when all HRs cost 3-5m and Ucs cost a minimum 5 and tokens cost 4-6m now your lucky to get those numbers on good stats ones fewer people trading than normal and tokens sell for 2mil (which is ridiculous btw). Why is this happening? First of all u look at the list for top ten of money in pwo 4 im sure of are banned or inactive 2 is staff members so that is roughly 4 billion out of circulation which hurts but is not the only problem. Since, coming back i have noticed the growing number of sinks Tm's, Transportation, Great ball upgrade have us putting money into the system which becomes lost now for the money to be put into the system u must farm or battle trainers which is a slow process so a vast amount of money lost from person to person is being lost in money sinks. The biggest issue of all though is the lack of circulation among active players the players who are active meaning the rich people aren't spending money which makes sense since the players that are rich are older players and already have a large collection so they need little else, but if the rich players are holding on to their money that leaves the bottom half to circulate the cash flow but since they cant sell pokes they normally choose to hold until they have a chance to buy something they really want or need. So any solutions here?

1.) find a way to get money circulating better which could be something like the old auctions but then find a way to put money back into the system for how much ever was lost
2. )update the token store, it is so incredibly outdated there are VR token pokes and some hrs are 12-15 tokens. i t has become stale the only real raise in prices was when the TSS first came
3.) Raise money earned from trainers or wild pokes( trainers seems more viable as it would be harder to cheat those)
4.) Add some roaming harder to catch pokes that rotate so you cant just force farm one place (would add new pokes to force more circulation)


All these things are strictly opinions and though most people seem to point to the TS as the problem i highly disagree without it the circulation would halt since at the moment a big part of it is through tokens or S UCs or epic Ucs.

Thanks for Reading
Dasnowman

 

[Hionn]

Finnally someone talking about economy.

INFLATION!

First of all inflation would mean there is a surplus of money so it loses value and things would go up in price which i can assure you there is not

So i have been around pwo since 2011 when all HRs cost 3-5m and Ucs cost a minimum 5 and tokens cost 4-6m now your lucky to get those numbers on good stats ones fewer people trading than normal and tokens sell for 2mil (which is ridiculous btw). Why is this happening? First of all u look at the list for top ten of money in pwo 4 im sure of are banned or inactive 2 is staff members so that is roughly 4 billion out of circulation which hurts but is not the only problem. Since, coming back i have noticed the growing number of sinks Tm's, Transportation, Great ball upgrade have us putting money into the system which becomes lost now for the money to be put into the system u must farm or battle trainers which is a slow process so a vast amount of money lost from person to person is being lost in money sinks. The biggest issue of all though is the lack of circulation among active players the players who are active meaning the rich people aren't spending money which makes sense since the players that are rich are older players and already have a large collection so they need little else, but if the rich players are holding on to their money that leaves the bottom half to circulate the cash flow but since they cant sell pokes they normally choose to hold until they have a chance to buy something they really want or need. So any solutions here?

1.) find a way to get money circulating better which could be something like the old auctions but then find a way to put money back into the system for how much ever was lost
2. )update the token store, it is so incredibly outdated there are VR token pokes and some hrs are 12-15 tokens. i t has become stale the only real raise in prices was when the TSS first came
3.) Raise money earned from trainers or wild pokes( trainers seems more viable as it would be harder to cheat those)
4.) Add some roaming harder to catch pokes that rotate so you cant just force farm one place (would add new pokes to force more circulation)


All these things are strictly opinions and though most people seem to point to the TS as the problem i highly disagree without it the circulation would halt since at the moment a big part of it is through tokens or S UCs or epic Ucs.

Thanks for Reading
Dasnowman

This is not the problem. The problem was already said. We have a lot of very nice pokes for sale and a little amount of buyers, how many buyers/sellers do you see in trade? I think really hard to see someone looking for a specif pokemon and can't find it easy, except if it's perfect ivs battler or something like vr+. I'll remeber you of the problem: there's no new players on pwo to balance the number of sellers and buyers. Increasing the amount of money in circulation on pwo, will only make everyone become rich and nobody will accept poke$ for sell pokemons, once it's useless. I personally think a mystery how poke$ is accept and wanted by everyone in pwo. Sorry bad English, but i hope everyone understand it.

 

[Shiningamisgirl]

I agree with what Hionn said. There's too many sellers, not enough buyers. Unless its something UC or some impossibly rare S Pokemon that only the luckiest of gods may catch (An S Salamence for example) You get an S sala, and then tell me how you cant sell it for mondo major moolah.

The issue is that people are less lazy and more willing to hunt/catch their own good iv Pokemon, or their own S rather than buy it, and there are lots of Pokemon in circulation (Not lots of money, but lots of Pokemon!) There's also a lack of new people to buy these things, when people do catch it. Even then though, why would I buy what you have? What do you have that I cant get on my own, that I should spend all of this money I don't have on?

Its like..Why is good bread $2.50 at the store? (Lets say its Walmart, and lets say its decent bread, not that cheap wonderbread junk..) The reason that bread is..or isnt..so cheap. Is because the price of the ingredients that make bread (Flour, baking soda, yeast, water, salt. Thats the bare minimum for bread. The rest is extras for flavor, texture, color.) is sooo cheap, that everyone with an oven could easily go out and make their own bread.

So they keep the price of bread low enough; that people don't do that. Because then it's cheaper, faster, and easier to buy pre-made bread. Its either that, or its taste, and when taste comes in, money becomes less of an object (Starbucks v.s any other coffee.) Maybe I like my coffee shiny, and not normal? Or I don't like making my own coffee, cause I don't know how to boil water...or own a coffee maker..or grinder..or..etc. Make mah coffee for me coffee slave!

You're trying to sell me bread. I can already make my own, I have all of the ingredients on hand, why do I need yours?
Is it because:
A. Its a good specialty bread that only you can make? Like bread from a bakery? (Good iv's Pokemon.)
B. An imported bread that's hard to find in my area! (An S pokemon that isn't easy to catch! )
C. A bread that takes a lot of time to make, and I don't have time to make it myself from scratch! (All of the above, and HR's)
D. I have no heat source, no oven, no bread maker, not even a fire pit! I need your fire! I'm a beginner bread maker who cant make bread! (I am too lazy, poor, inexperienced, lacking in allll things, to make bread. I have no money, or fire..which..probably means I cant buy your bread in the first place..Why are you trying to sell me bread again?)
E: I am a collector of breads. Take my money! I don't care what the bread is. I just want yours! (Collectors who buy Pokemon just for the sake of buying Pokemon, do exist, but they base what prices they buy them for on the same factors as every other buyer. They wont pay 10k for your pidgey, but they might just buy it so they can get it outta the way on their dex.)

If the answer to any of those is 'no'. Then I'm not gonna buy your bread. I'll just go make my own darn bread. Even if it takes 2 hrs to bake, and I need to get the ingredients first. If my bread wont be any different then your bread, I wont waste money on it.

There are two solutions to this: Kill all of the other bread makers, so that you are the only bread maker in town! Then everyone will buy your bread for whatever price you ask! OR! Lower the price of your bread, so that I'll be interested in buying it. Since there are 10,000,000 bread sellers, selling the same kinds of bread, at similar prices. Unless of course we get a sudden huge influx of new people, and even if we did, it'd take time for them to get the money to buy your over-priced bread. Sooo...yups...

 

[Symbiosis]

Well dude, i speak also for a sense of frustration. I have spent over 150+ tokens all to ger Uc's with the shiny bonus and not get one, then the first newby at his first try (he is a friend of mine) got his S Uc as a result of incredible luck. I want to think that is fair if it happen in game, to find Shiny rare, Vrare, and Hrare, but not in this way. I'm just wondering what will happen to the game if nobody won't donate anymore.

I don't know about you but I plan on donating monthly a good $100.00-$200.00 USD. Even once I have everything in the shop theres the point in buying with real cash to sell in-game. While some may not find this fair for whatever reason(I don't feel like having a debate on poor or rich) There are people who work and can afford to dish out real cash for a game. It not only benefits me as a player in-game by having nice pokemon, extra in-game items and cash but it also helps the server keep being playable and progression to be made. So if you think people may stop donating then something is wrong because even if there is a decrease in donations you still have people who donate high enough amounts to keep the server going, I also find it a little sad that you would think a such thing without thinking of what is keeping the game running and you playing.

 

[Franc92]

Well dude, i speak also for a sense of frustration. I have spent over 150+ tokens all to ger Uc's with the shiny bonus and not get one, then the first newby at his first try (he is a friend of mine) got his S Uc as a result of incredible luck. I want to think that is fair if it happen in game, to find Shiny rare, Vrare, and Hrare, but not in this way. I'm just wondering what will happen to the game if nobody won't donate anymore.

I don't know about you but I plan on donating monthly a good $100.00-$200.00 USD. Even once I have everything in the shop theres the point in buying with real cash to sell in-game. While some may not find this fair for whatever reason(I don't feel like having a debate on poor or rich) There are people who work and can afford to dish out real cash for a game. It not only benefits me as a player in-game by having nice pokemon, extra in-game items and cash but it also helps the server keep being playable and progression to be made. So if you think people may stop donating then something is wrong because even if there is a decrease in donations you still have people who donate high enough amounts to keep the server going, I also find it a little sad that you would think a such thing without thinking of what is keeping the game running and you playing.

I totally disagree with you. First of all you missed my point. I was frustrated because of the great difference between money in real life and in what you can buy with them and pokedollars in game. If you compare this game with others Beta games you will notice that spending money for having new items and something like that is very worthy compared with PWO. I don't care who donate 1000$ in a year or more, they can do all they want for having great pokes and helping the system of gameplaying to improve. I'm not complaining about the whole system. I'm complaining only wiht TS System that has to be renewed and i was only wondering if nobody donate anymore what will happen.

 

[Franc92]

Plus, as far as i know the downloading and the registration and the whole playing is FREE. So don't feel like you "MUST" donate every month 100-200$ every month for the benefit of the game.

 

[Symbiosis]

Yes it is free but I enjoy knowing the fact that I help support and keep the game going. There is a cost for the game even though it is free to play. The game/data and online connection all run on a dedicated hosting server in which cost money and they aren't cheap, I have ran my own game and a couple forums before, I know from experience. While they say it is free they do expect/hope that people will donate. I honestly have no problem with how the economy is now. It is the same as the real world economy. The strong survive and the weak don't.

 

[Symbiosis]

I was just stating that I understand your frustrated but I doubt it will change but you shouldn't be hoping people stop donating because if they do PWO will be gone or at least restricted to a way lower number of playerbase it can hold if they have to switch to a normal PC to run it on.