Natures, New Game+, and Regional Story Quests

[Sylpharionz]

I now notice you throw out ad hominem attacks simply because you cannot back up your statement with damage calculations where the extra IV actually matters. I also notice how you tried to strawman me by saying it is getting derailed when you were the first one to mention how 32 iv was unfair and you didn't like it.

If you cannot back up your arguments then don't bother trying to tear other's arguments down. I provided math and you have not. This is apparent. You have not conclusively shown why an extra point matters in damage calculation and as such you are dismissed.

Please refrain from posting in this thread since you continue to refuse to actually make a post with any substance to them and instead just want to keep repeating your opinion.

+1 for this, I think everyone knows who is the kid here. Obviously the one who failed Math saying that 1 IV makes a difference.

 

[Poisonivy]

Well....how about that...the 1 point of difference literally didn't effect anything. (The calculator does not allow 32, but the mathematical difference is the same.)
I don't care how emotional someone gets, if you can't back it up then don't bother trying to make yourself seem relevant. I even tested something with a super effective multiplier of 2x to make the difference more drastic in case of a change. If you want to call me a child, big meanie, or biased go ahead. It doesn't make you any more right about your position.

Well i tested this pokemonshowdown calculator you used and put in the same thing. like 252 SpA Jolteon Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Lapras: 216-254.
And i started to change the IVs for the Jolteon. I seen the % didnt change till i got to 25IV Sattk. That was for your lvl 100 Jolteon and Lapras.

Now i did this with lvl 99 Jolteon and Lapras and the% changed on 30IV & 26IV (Sattk Jolteon)
And i tested this with other pokemon and for some, the % would change on every IV.

So what you proved is that some: pokemon VS pokemon 1IV dont matter.
I would like to see a calculator for this game and not pokemon X and Y, i dont play that. Im guessing one for this game could be different??



Edit: adding this
I never call you a child, big meanie, or biased go ahead. Tho in my last post i did say I felt like i was talking to a kid but that was to Sylpharionz not you.

 

[Sylpharionz]

Well....how about that...the 1 point of difference literally didn't effect anything. (The calculator does not allow 32, but the mathematical difference is the same.)
I don't care how emotional someone gets, if you can't back it up then don't bother trying to make yourself seem relevant. I even tested something with a super effective multiplier of 2x to make the difference more drastic in case of a change. If you want to call me a child, big meanie, or biased go ahead. It doesn't make you any more right about your position.

Well i tested this pokemonshowdown calculator you used and put in the same thing. like 252 SpA Jolteon Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Lapras: 216-254.
And i started to change the IVs for the Jolteon. I seen the % didnt change till i got to 25IV Sattk. That was for your lvl 100 Jolteon and Lapras.

Now i did this with lvl 99 Jolteon and Lapras and the% changed on 30IV & 26IV (Sattk Jolteon)
And i tested this with other pokemon and for some, the % would change on every IV.

So what you proved is that some: pokemon VS pokemon 1IV dont matter.
I would like to see a calculator for this game and not pokemon X and Y, i dont play that. Im guessing one for this game could be different??

Everywhere the Math is the same, have you heard of the term rounding up? Or whole integer? That's the main reason why 1 IV does not matter at all, ever...

 

[Electrofreak]

Sylpharionz is right about this one honestly. Also just for information purposes, that same calculator has been up for years even prior to X and Y. The calculation formula has not changed but rather the amount of pokemon within the database changed and that sort of thing.

Pokemon has used the same calculator for multiple generations, and PWO is working within generation 5 mechanics, barring hidden power working with gen 6 mechanics for ease of getting something usable. I hope that helps.

The lower the level, the more each individual stat matters. Think of it in terms of diminishing returns on fractions.

1/4 = 25%
1/100 = 1%

One point goes further the lower overall pool of stats. That being said if you lower the level to say 5, 1 point will go much further. I honestly forgot to change them to level 99 in the original post, but it doesn't make much difference given the large pool.

One other thing to keep in mind, is that IVs do not all instantly get put into a pokemon's stat. Instead it gets distributed throughout the leveling process up to 100.

I honestly don't mind giving information if you have any questions by the way. The problem is that most people in the game currently are widely ignorant of how the mechanics actually work within the game. This is a problem I am trying to fight against by giving as much information as possible. Right now many people think there are problems that don't actually exist, while completely ignoring the obvious problems right in front of them.

Natures, or more specifically the lack thereof, have always been a much more prevalent problem than the mostly non-existent problem of IVs mathematically aside from the speed stat. Speed is in a weird position on its own in terms of calculations since it is way more straight forward and is only relevant on some pokemon. However for the pokemon that speed is highly relevant, it is something that might be worth making higher trade-offs for.

Natures having that -10% and +10% effect end up giving sway to large stat transpositions. By sacrificing 10% from a stat that is say base 60, you would be gaining a monstrous 10% from something say base 130.

 

[HitmonFonty]

Everyone's opinion is valid, and it's one thing to tell someone they are off-topic and spoiling your thread- another to tell them to leave because you don't like their argument.

Not every player has to understand your math, and if they don't you are asking them to have faith in it. To many the fact that there are pokemon with stats no longer possible to achieve in this game is unfair. You can argue it's not, and give your reasons and that's fine. But their opinions and reasons are just as valid whether you understand or accept them or not.

In future if you want someone to leave your thread and stop posting, talk to a GM about it rather than attempting to moderate your own thread.

 

[Electrofreak]

Everyone's opinion is valid, and it's one thing to tell someone they are off-topic and spoiling your thread- another to tell them to leave because you don't like their argument.

Not every player has to understand your math, and if they don't you are asking them to have faith in it. To many the fact that there are pokemon with stats no longer possible to achieve in this game is unfair. You can argue it's not, and give your reasons and that's fine. But their opinions and reasons are just as valid whether you understand or accept them or not.

In future if you want someone to leave your thread and stop posting, talk to a GM about it rather than attempting to moderate your own thread.

Fonty, if you read my post, I never said that an opinion is the issue here. Opinions can be emotional in nature. Opinions are subjective and don't always have to match how reality actualizes. I said many times that they can have their opinion and I do not mind. The problem I do have is when people make truth claims and then do not back them up with data.

When someone comes and says something is or isn't the case, that is no longer a statement of opinion, that becomes a factual truth claim. At that point, they are leaving the realm of opinion by definition. Once they leave that realm they lose the safety of emotion and rhetoric and must back themselves up in a public arena.

If you look further into my post, I am merely saying that I will not respond to rhetoric but only to hard facts and data in regards to the data I posted. I said I would not respond to rhetoric as there is no point, because there indeed is none. I am not here to espouse opinion on numbers and calculations.

If there was a problem with the non-math based parts of my post, then the realm of opinion applies, but to math it does not.

Furthermore Fonty, I am not asking people to merely trust my math. Poisonivy herself went and checked it to verify. That is the nature of math, it is able to be peer reviewed. I did not hide where I got my formula and it is used by the major battling community smogon. This is all able to be fact checked. I am not going to sit here and entertain politically correct statements when the information is available to people who are actually bothered to check. If they can't even be bothered to check something before responding, then they have no real reason to post in a thread about game balance. (If for some weird reason you don't trust smogon, then feel free to use the formula from bulbapedia or the VGC calculator on nugget bridge.)

Bottom line is Poisonivy actually did listen in the end to the math posted, took the time to educate herself, and for that I commend her. Please do not defend ignorance as we have enough of that.

As for the comment about posting to a GM to moderate the thread, it is unnecessary as I refuse to respond to posts that do not go anywhere. I am trying to hold a discussion, and you cannot have a discussion with emotional rhetoric. Furthermore GMs do not even remove posts such as: http://forum.pokemon-world-online.net/showthread.php?tid=37040 when reported. I have done so in the past and directly reported harassment with no avail many times. Why should I bother?

I was simply making the point that I cannot respond to opinions and will not when the subject matter is in the domain of mathematics, which is verifiable by a series of programs.

When talking about math there is only true and false, not opinion. If you notice most of the time was dealing with the math, not the section about the PVE stuff.


TL;DR
Funtea plz