Evolution Items

[Merse]

To add my two cents to the OP: I think it would be awesome if we would have multiple evolution items. It could be fascinating to find out which item is required to evolve certain Pokemon, then find it. It not only would give more depth to the endgame, but it would open up endless possibilities. I already see before my eyes a big excavation site where you can pick up various quests to pick up fossils and whatnot which would reward you with an evo item for Piloswine, Anorith, Cradily, or much later, to acquire Pokes like Kabuto, Omanyte, Cranidos, or Shieldon.

 

[Tecknician]

it's a completely different issue as is tecks point about how someone who hasn't been to the later regions wouldn't know what can be found there.

You are mistaken, my point isn't what you said but rather they wouldn't know what exists at all.

It's not like we have been against adding evolution items for 4th gen pokemon. I am actually perfectly fine with it. However I think they should flow well with the game and not simply because "It would do this and that to the battle system".

I was trying to bring out a more in depth discussion as far as the meta game. No one wanted to play ball, and instead took it as I was trying to find an excuse not to add them, I am to blame for this.

Suggestions are rather meaningless without more discussion behind them. Few questions I wanted answered is "Why should evolution items be added as far as a story angle" and "How should these items be added other than just as items, should people do quests to obtain them? What sort of story would be a product of these items?" ultimately "How do these items exist in this universe?"

While it's important to build on the game from a mechanics standpoint, I think it's equally important to consider back story and the universe as a whole when we try to add things in game. For example, a former staff member had a plan for the train system mapped out and ready to be added. I decided I liked the idea and took it a step further adding the ferries and using the same ticket system.

Even with the skarmory event a few months back, we could have easily just made the pokes easier to find and that players collected items and I am sure most players would have been just as happy. However a back story was made to fit the goals in mind and as a result made the event more fluid.

 

[Thor]

I do not really see evolution as something that should need a story, although I guess for continuity as Zeb said, evolution items should do. Im not even really for evolution items such as magmarize, dusk stone and things that would usually be found in another region as that would then fall under the same category as non evolution 4th generation pokemon. My main focus is the pokemon who evolve when they learn a certain move, so aipom, lickitung, yanma, piloswine, tangela (mime jr, bonsly). TMs are now possible so it seems to me a logical extension could be an item which say teaches ancient power or double hit and as a consequence causes such pokemon to evolve. It is evident that in the later pokemon worlds, travel between the regions is greater, and as a consequence the spread of new pokemon, new items, new moves to the older regions would be higher. In terms of PWOs storyline maybe the improvements in the train system meant that some traveller managed to bring these new items that teach ancient power to johto and kanto with the knowledge that they would cause these pokemon to evolve.

I would also like you to clarify again your point about not knowing what exists at all. PWO isnt set in the past, PWO is set in the future where communication between regions would be greater and so knowledge of other places would be common. I dont think it seems reasonable to think that each individual region would have no knowledge of everywhere else, what is found there and is in its own little bubble.

Maybe if you wanted a story for other evolution methods, maybe a convention of poke-scientists conforms every month or two to discuss the latest theories on evolution bringing stones from other regions and the like which people can purchase. Maybe make it so to gain entry to the convention, a kanto or johto scientist needs to quickly get a fire stone, or leaf stone, etc so he has something to present at the conference and if you get one for him he has a spare ticket. I dont know these are just ideas off the top of my head.

 

[CheckeredZebra]

I think I have a suggestion that would make players happy and addresses concerns brought up about 4th gen evo items.

To fix lategame tedium and make other concerns work out, I think it would be interesting to build on Bobo's point here:

PWO isnt set in the past, PWO is set in the future where communication between regions would be greater and so knowledge of other places would be common. I dont think it seems reasonable to think that each individual region would have no knowledge of everywhere else, what is found there and is in its own little bubble.

Specifically, I'm thinking about trade routes. Not ones the player directly interacts with, but the merchants could have established some within reason.

Spoiler: Optional:Future-Trade-Route-Specifics

Have only a few specific gen. items be in merchant shops due to budding trade routes that have been established in the previous 15 years. So for example, the Dusk Stone might be in Kanto/Johto (at an expensive price). But, the Oval Stone might ONLY be in Sinnoh/Hoenn. Meanwhile a Dusk Stone in Sinnoh will be less expensive than in Johto but can be present in both regions at different prices. For another example, a Johto-specific evolution item (such as King's Rock) can be cheaper in its home region than, say, Sinnoh, and won't be obtainable in Unova at all.

(King's Rock in Johto- $5,000. Dusk Stone in Johto- $15,000.
King's Rock in Sinnoh- $15,000. Dusk Stone in Sinnoh- $5,000
Sun Stone available in Johto and not Unova, Razor Claw available in Sinnoh but not Kanto, etc.)

It keeps a money sink, makes sense story-wise, and removes most tedium. The more distant a region is from another, the more expensive the item becomes. (So Kanto and Johto will have relatively similar prices, but Kanto and Unova would have larger price differences.)

Another system that could be done in the immediate future also allows the slow release (and even rotation) of some evolution items without crowding our current 2 regions.
Let's say you had a specialty trader on the Dept. Store roof that rotated stock every once in a while as he bartered with Sinnoh/Unova/Hoenn for items "unavailable" from the region he is peddling in. (So he could sell a Razor Claw in Kanto for a limited time when it would otherwise be unobtainable there.) These items could be much more expensive than that region's dept. store evo items (EG: Leaf Stone or Expensive Dusk Stone). And, his stock could be limited, making players excited for each new rotation.

The only downside is that specialty merchants would have to be updated every once in a while. You wouldn't have to do this very often; he could be available for 1 week per season (Because he has to travel to a whole distant region to barter his wares and get new stock!)

Pros:
This lets pokemon evolve into their 4th gen counterparts evenly without sloppily adding some 4th gens and not others (they'll all be possible eventually), works almost as a "mini-event" in and of itself which would get players excited with less effort, is a money sink, makes sense within the world, does not crowd the region with misplaced merchant NPCs.

Future Trade route specifics- Adds money sinks, removes the tedium of lategame players traveling around the globe just to get region-specific items, shows progress of the Pokemon world.

Cons:
Somebody has to remember to update the merchant once in a while. IIRC, this would just be updating his script to sell a single different item and otherwise have him say "I'm waiting on more stock." or be removed from the game until he can be used again. Not impossible; it's just a small chore.

Simplified:

Certain evolution items could be available in some regions but not others. Other non-native stones could be available in the dept but at a higher price than its home region (So Johto's King's Rock would be cheaper in Johto than in Sinnoh.) A specialty merchant could be used to sell region-exclusive items, such as selling a Razor Claw in Kanto, for a limited time and a high price. He would rotate stock once in a while.

 

[Thor]

Yup thats kind of the idea I was getting at as a way of introducing them, I think it ties in well and rotating what's available at certain times would add more excitement to it. It makes sense that these merchants could be located near cities which have strong ferry or train links. Maybe the ports and stations do very rare ferries and trains to the other regions and when they come back they bring back these new foreign evolution items.

 

[psychosamm]

Suggestions are rather meaningless without more discussion behind them. Few questions I wanted answered is "Why should evolution items be added as far as a story angle"

To be honest there isn't much of a storyline period in PWO, it's just kind of assumed that you know to go beat all the gyms and bam you're done. So saying that evo items need a story is kind of ironic in my opinion. But if you feel a story is needed i like Bobo's idea of a Scientist convention which you need to gain access to.

and "How should these items be added other than just as items, should people do quests to obtain them? What sort of story would be a product of these items?" ultimately "How do these items exist in this universe?"

I don't think most evo items need a story, it should be common knowledge that these items evolve the pokemon. Like Bobo said, PWO is set in the future, the citizens aren't ignorant of everything. If anything it should be a story around simply how you obtain the item, not its existence and usage being discovered. Perhaps some sort of small event is made around slowly releasing certain evo items, such as Sneasel> Weavile, Duskull> Dusknoir, Murkrow> Honchkrow, etc. Someone could get a hold of these "rare" items, and they will give you one if you help them with something, as a different idea. Though i think Bobo's idea sounds cool.

 

[HitmonFonty]

I think the idea sounds good too, but I disagree with you that the story isn't needed. PWO has always intended to have a background story, it's just not a priority so is taking a long time to implement. You could probably say there is a story building up in the background to the background story ;D and we try to make everything we add now to make sense with that when it finally does get put in- to save time later let's say, though that isn't the only reason. This isn't just a battling game, it's a role playing game and as such the more story we can get into it the more fun it will become to be part of.

Also as far as the evo's being common knowledge, I don't think that's necessarily true. The idea throughout the anime is that such knowledge takes a lot of study and research to discover, and typically knowledge of other regions in particular seems pretty basic if it's there at all.

 

[Tecknician]

Quickly on the subject of background story: You are partially correct, having smaller stories eventually starts to make up a larger story, kinda like a puzzle. With an MMO I do not necessarily think there needs to be a "main single person story" as the same events happening 10,000 times doesn't exactly make sense to me. There simply needs to be some sort of reasoning for doing things. There is no reason to collect badges currently other than to gain access to more places to become a better trainer. This is a problem.

Bobo - I was actually seeing if someone would raise pwo is suppose to be set in the future, I am glad you did.

 

[OGPokemaster]

There is no reason to collect badges currently other than to gain access to more places to become a better trainer. This is a problem.

well i might be going off topic a bit but another reason for badges, other then the obvious elite 4, is so that pokemon with higher levels obey you. with the first badge pokemon up to lvl 20 obey you, 2nd badge pokemon up to lvl 30, 3rd badge lvl 40, etc. Also in the new games the more badges you get the more items that become available to you, maybe you can add the use of evolution items based on the badges you have or something, furthermore they where able to let you use HMs but seeing as theres no HMs you can make them unlock the use of certain tms. but unless you plan on adding a feature to make these things happen, or maybe add the E4, this will always be a problem unless something is changed about it.

As for the evolution items i think bobo and zebbys idea is pretty good and makes for a much better back story then just adding them in-game and being done with it.
And to answer your questions teck

"Why should evolution items be added as far as a story angle" Well adding anything in pwo can make for a great angle in the story, but i think evolution items (and TMs ) especially, make for amazing quest/story rewards, look at last years winter event, the ancient tablet made it one of pwos most successful events. and every event in and of itself is an angle for the story of pwo. but bear in mind i don't think evo items should effect the main story, i think it would be better if they stayed as side quest rewards, this would actually solve the problem with having to make their story or quests match with the overall main story of pwo because you don't necessarily have to connect a side story with the main one.

"How should these items be added other than just as items, should people do quests to obtain them? What sort of story would be a product of these items?" i think bobo and zebbys idea answered these questions fairly well, and to add to it, i think a combination quest rewards and just being able to buy them at certain times like they suggested would work the best. as far as the story product like i said in the last question it would provide a more variety of quests to add to the end game.

"How do these items exist in this universe?" again bobo and zebbys idea answers this very well.

 

[Diablo1134]

Yeah, it would be sweet to have a kings rock in the game

 

[KstersSlade]

Yeah, it would be sweet to have a kings rock in the game

King's rock wouldn't work anyway, multi-evolution is not supported by the game. So poliwhirl and slowpoke wouldn't be able to evolve into politoed and slowking.

 

[Merse]

It doesn't work YET. But since TMs are available, I wouldn't be surprised is things would change. If not later, then when our dear Hardcoreh finishes his work

 

[Dragon16]

Well i was just wondering if porygon will get Upgrade soon, if not it seems kinda pointless to have in the tokens store if it cant evolve...