Bluerise and Xanatus

[Merse]

You have no rights, none, everything to do with pwo is a privilege. You have the right to live, you have the privilege to play this game. Seriously players are are too entitled around here, about as bad as staff members.

And that's exactly what Xan abuses.

 

[matileo19]

Your answer isn't answering the question I'm making to Xanatus. As donators, we have the rights to know how much there's in the bank, as thats our money, not yours. Somehow we have the right to decide stuff to do with the money. Still, will be a pleasure to have a 2nd answer from xanatus and not a partner.


HAHAHHA your money? Your an idiot mati, it WAS your money. As a donator you gave it away trusting the person you gave it to. It is no longer your money, if you don't trust the person don't donate.

You have no rights, none, everything to do with pwo is a privilege. You have the right to live, you have the privilege to play this game. Seriously players are are too entitled around here, about as bad as staff members.

Not really, have you ever donated something ? Not to pwo. As a donator, I have the RIGHTS to know where goes my money and whats gonna happen with the funds I've donated, not to mention the rest of the RIGHTS I have. Take a look to the topic I'm gonna make, tomorrow. Eat a banana Mad.

 

[Boora]

MAd, you're the idiot in this case, no offense,
if i donated money to a cause lets say research effectively its not my money anymore but i will get updates on the reasearch and be welcomed there.
but if i suspect that my money is going to a different place well thats a scam and illeagal,
your mind set is correct, but only when the money souly goes to maintain the Server.
they suspect that xan is using the moto "you donated "fu" its my money to do with as i please now.
instead of keeping it in one place, even it its way more then he needs.
we Donate to keep the servers up, you have too much money ? buy better servers ?
using the best one's already ? stop taking donations..... until you need more.
the game survived 4-5 years without a donating system, and from what i can recall its around 100$ a month to keep the server running
people spent thounsands maybe even tens of thousands of dollars every month trying to get (S)uc's .
Do the math.

 

[HitmonFonty]

the game survived 4-5 years without a donating system, and from what i can recall its around 100$ a month to keep the server running
people spent thounsands maybe even tens of thousands of dollars every month trying to get (S)uc's .
Do the math.

PWO has always had donations, they pay for it to run. I'm not sure who told you it survived 4-5 years without donations but it is just wrong.

I have no idea how much the server costs now but in the past PWO paid $800 a month to godaddy for 3 servers- one to run the game worth $400 per month and $200 each for the other two which were used for the website.

Thousands- maybe. Though very few players have done this as far as I'm aware. And tens of thousands per month seems like a very way out figure! I'd like to know where you got that from.

It seems the longer this discussion goes on the more inaccurate it gets. The 'math' will never work if it starts with the wrong figures.

 

[BRGodEastwood]

the game survived 4-5 years without a donating system, and from what i can recall its around 100$ a month to keep the server running
people spent thounsands maybe even tens of thousands of dollars every month trying to get (S)uc's .
Do the math.

PWO has always had donations, they pay for it to run. I'm not sure who told you it survived 4-5 years without donations but it is just wrong.

I have no idea how much the server costs now but in the past PWO paid $800 a month to godaddy for 3 servers- one to run the game worth $400 per month and $200 each for the other two which were used for the website.

Thousands- maybe. Though very few players have done this as far as I'm aware. And tens of thousands per month seems like a very way out figure! I'd like to know where you got that from.

It seems the longer this discussion goes on the more inaccurate it gets. The 'math' will never work if it starts with the wrong figures.

According to the kid thats trying to get staff (Isguros I think his name was?) Pwo made $122,000 in the year of 2013. Adjusted per month, thats $10k per month. Judging from reading the post, it seems Boora meant people as a whole, not just one person. Either way, I think you probably should stop posting on here fonty, no one wants to hear from a mouthpiece who isnt aware of whats going on. All you're doing is further enraging people. "We need a pool of money for server replacements when these become necessary." Like really?

 

[Xanatus]

Alright, I gonna give you some information on how the money is used:

In 2012 i bought 3 super cars because I coudn't decide which whould fit me best so I got a McLaren, Ferrari and Königsegg.
In 2013 I didnt need that much speed anymore, so I wanted to buy an Astion Martin, but I ran out of parking space and so I had to buy myself a castle first to have enough space for upcomming cars.
In 2014 I got sick of cars and thought I gonna get myself an airport build and get my custom aircarfts.
Right now I'm planning to get my own rocket station build for my next vacation on the moon, but I'm still missing a few billions for that, but pwo should get enough donations in 2 or 3 months so I can get it started.

Ok seriously...


PWO's donation aren't any that great that its even worth talking about, but since you guys come up with so many romours, I gonna reply to a few of them.

"PWO made 3k last weekend! I know it!"
Sure, please go ahead and post your proof, because not ever in history of pwo did it make that much of money in such a short period of time.


The money is used for server upkeeping and additional servers when needed, as some are planned for the future.
Server costs are fairly high as we are on an anti-ddos plan for the game server to gaurantee uptime. Bandwidth costs, esspecialy during ddos attacks, are very expensive.
PWO is ran as personal project, so costs can't be reduced from taxes and so the taxes are fairly high as well. There are also conversion and transaction fees from paypal I won't go into details here.

A pool of money is saved for suprisingly high bandwidth costs or other emergency cases such as donation outage or deficencies over some period of time.

Whats left as profit is going to be used for additinal server upgrades. For example we are considering an anti-ddos plan for the webserver if becoming necessary and there are other things you will get announcements soon, considering the future of the project.

PWO money has not been used to buy any cars, houses, or whatever and not been used to finance other games.

For all the lifetime of PWO, it had worked like this and you have to agree we did a good job on it to keep everything running through good and bad times.
This is thanks to you all.

 

[Sabo]

Alright, I gonna give you some information on how the money is used:

In 2012 i bought 3 super cars because I coudn't decide which whould fit me best so I got a McLaren, Ferrari and Königsegg.
In 2013 I didnt need that much speed anymore, so I wanted to buy an Astion Martin, but I ran out of parking space and so I had to buy myself a castle first to have enough space for upcomming cars.
In 2014 I got sick of cars and thought I gonna get myself an airport build and get my custom aircarfts.
Right now I'm planning to get my own rocket station build for my next vacation on the moon, but I'm still missing a few billions for that, but pwo should get enough donations in 2 or 3 months so I can get it started.

Ok seriously...


PWO's donation aren't any that great that its even worth talking about, but since you guys come up with so many romours, I gonna reply to a few of them.

"PWO made 3k last weekend! I know it!"
Sure, please go ahead and post your proof, because not ever in history of pwo did it make that much of money in such a short period of time.


The money is used for server upkeeping and additional servers when needed, as some are planned for the future.
Server costs are fairly high as we are on an anti-ddos plan for the game server to gaurantee uptime. Bandwidth costs, esspecialy during ddos attacks, are very expensive.
PWO is ran as personal project, so costs can't be reduced from taxes and so the taxes are fairly high as well. There are also conversion and transaction fees from paypal I won't go into details here.

A pool of money is saved for suprisingly high bandwidth costs or other emergency cases such as donation outage or deficencies over some period of time.

Whats left as profit is going to be used for additinal server upgrades. For example we are considering an anti-ddos plan for the webserver if becoming necessary and there are other things you will get announcements soon, considering the future of the project.

PWO money has not been used to buy any cars, houses, or whatever and not been used to finance other games.

For all the lifetime of PWO, it had worked like this and you have to agree we did a good job on it to keep everything running through good and bad times.
This is thanks to you all.

Right, lets say it is everything you say and that you don't touch the money at all or using PWO money to pay people who are working on your private projects. Honestly I personally don't care where money is used soon as this game gets more stable and updated properly. Pretty sure people wouldn't say anything if you as main developer actually work sometimes with the team providing updates coding wise. I've had small meeting with several players and friends today about this. Honestly, it's not about money at all. It's about PWO failing to get updates. Also about websites ads, who gets the money from that you or Bluerise?

For you Shane might be unstable person but the guy did the job and a lot. The fact that Shane itself is acknowledging you as a lot better programmer then he is tells you a lot. Now my question to you xan is. Why don't you spend some time with PWO team and code something for them that will be useful for long term. Giving them CPR everytime problem occurs its meaningless. I figured all this hate in community is coming from lack of updates. People start pointing fingers and calling other useless then eventually hate begins.
I know you don't expect much from this PWO, its small game fan based shouldn't be perfect as you said. But at least can you give solid ground to work on. Give them small part as you did with Ebyron and the game will be better. What staff are doing is constantly patching up the same wound. You may recover from this incident and get new client, at least temporary one. But what will happen after. Who will do server updates, who will hardcode things into the server.

You see. Sometimes we often bash at staff. But thinking better most of them are awesome people who have to deal with hate often because they fail to deliever updates needed. PWO doesn't have to be super awesome. At least make it like few years ago where we had 900+ people online anytime. Things in this game are in hands in volonteurs in most of the cases. Considering their life schedule thats bad impact on the game. Yet you have there that staff culture which is often lazy and slow of doing things. Ermm...no not lazy, just lack of motivation. 6 years have passed and we are pretty much at the same spot.

Through this opportunity I would like to ask you to spend some time with staff and actually do some team work with them. Take any Pokemon game and compare it with PWO you will see the difference. Make one account, start playing from the beginning what will be your impression...broken moves...battles failing. Lack of features. No support for double battles etc. Lack of the auction system built in ingame...Hold items, abiltites, EVs and natures. All those are missing for years. If Ebyron, the game you made have multi battles why PWO is lacking of them? I honestly tried to get few friends to play PWO, I got ashamed everytime I called them. They are saying to me "is this Pokemon game for you".

Once again. I don't care much about the money soon as the game is getting updated. You spend some time with staff start doing something actually. You are main DEV for a christs sake. Even if you think that you tried to let other people to do that they failed. Get any former admin or dev to tell you with what limitations they were faced. Eventually they feel pressured and staff starting to be unstable as well. What is needed at the moment is work and work only. Someone like Shane to work 1 month on the game and thats it. At least from the money donated you can start coding things and updating. Make players and staff to feel comfortable in the game. Use some of the Ebyron code, copy paste renaming remoding you know. Move this thing on the road again. Don't make yourself and PWO staff useless while it can be different. Get a cup of coffee and start looking into the code and introduce and update stuff. Only that way game is going further.

-PWO Blaze

 

[Xanatus]

Thanks for your post, it was susprisingly well written and i appriciate it.

Yet I still won't go into discussion about these things here, as there is no chance that it will lead to anything, nor is it the time or place to do so.

I'm well aware to where the problems are and we are looking for solutions for quit a while now and we are working on things, but you will have to wait to see where that leads.

Something will come up soon!

 

[mad30]

MAd, you're the idiot in this case, no offense,
if i donated money to a cause lets say research effectively its not my money anymore but i will get updates on the reasearch and be welcomed there.
but if i suspect that my money is going to a different place well thats a scam and illeagal,
your mind set is correct, but only when the money souly goes to maintain the Server.
they suspect that xan is using the moto "you donated "fu" its my money to do with as i please now.
instead of keeping it in one place, even it its way more then he needs.
we Donate to keep the servers up, you have too much money ? buy better servers ?
using the best one's already ? stop taking donations..... until you need more.
the game survived 4-5 years without a donating system, and from what i can recall its around 100$ a month to keep the server running
people spent thounsands maybe even tens of thousands of dollars every month trying to get (S)uc's .
Do the math.

I think you misunderstand me,

Donators DO NOT HAVE THE /RIGHT/ to know where there money goes. However any good organization will be completely open to donators as they should be, and as pwo should. But to demand to know as if it's a right is absurd, simply stop donating if you are not being told where it is going and do not believe it is being put to good use THAT is your right.

 

[Boora]

MAd, you're the idiot in this case, no offense,
if i donated money to a cause lets say research effectively its not my money anymore but i will get updates on the reasearch and be welcomed there.
but if i suspect that my money is going to a different place well thats a scam and illeagal,
your mind set is correct, but only when the money souly goes to maintain the Server.
they suspect that xan is using the moto "you donated "fu" its my money to do with as i please now.
instead of keeping it in one place, even it its way more then he needs.
we Donate to keep the servers up, you have too much money ? buy better servers ?
using the best one's already ? stop taking donations..... until you need more.
the game survived 4-5 years without a donating system, and from what i can recall its around 100$ a month to keep the server running
people spent thounsands maybe even tens of thousands of dollars every month trying to get (S)uc's .
Do the math.

I think you misunderstand me,

Donators DO NOT HAVE THE /RIGHT/ to know where there money goes. However any good organization will be completely open to donators as they should be, and as pwo should. But to demand to know as if it's a right is absurd, simply stop donating if you are not being told where it is going and do not believe it is being put to good use THAT is your right.

i dont know if you ever donated for something irl mad, but you're wrong to a point at least
what stoping me from setting up a donation for some disease and pocketing the money
again, its illeagel, i have to show proof and paper work that my charity/foundation really delivers the money/does what it suppose to do
you do have a point when saying if its shady don't donate, but again who really donates , in pwo at least they just "buy" tokens.

and xan, do let us know how much money you made during the 15+iv "special" with high shiny chance weekend.
as i know of at least over 3k usd just from "OGael" guild and friends on Xat/irc
i myself had around 600 tokens that day, and i'm one of hundreds.

 

[mad30]

MAd, you're the idiot in this case, no offense,
if i donated money to a cause lets say research effectively its not my money anymore but i will get updates on the reasearch and be welcomed there.
but if i suspect that my money is going to a different place well thats a scam and illeagal,
your mind set is correct, but only when the money souly goes to maintain the Server.
they suspect that xan is using the moto "you donated "fu" its my money to do with as i please now.
instead of keeping it in one place, even it its way more then he needs.
we Donate to keep the servers up, you have too much money ? buy better servers ?
using the best one's already ? stop taking donations..... until you need more.
the game survived 4-5 years without a donating system, and from what i can recall its around 100$ a month to keep the server running
people spent thounsands maybe even tens of thousands of dollars every month trying to get (S)uc's .
Do the math.

I think you misunderstand me,

Donators DO NOT HAVE THE /RIGHT/ to know where there money goes. However any good organization will be completely open to donators as they should be, and as pwo should. But to demand to know as if it's a right is absurd, simply stop donating if you are not being told where it is going and do not believe it is being put to good use THAT is your right.

i dont know if you ever donated for something irl mad, but you're wrong to a point at least
what stoping me from setting up a donation for some disease and pocketing the money
again, its illeagel, i have to show proof and paper work that my charity/foundation really delivers the money/does what it suppose to do
you do have a point when saying if its shady don't donate, but again who really donates , in pwo at least they just "buy" tokens.

and xan, do let us know how much money you made during the 15+iv "special" with high shiny chance weekend.
as i know of at least over 3k usd just from "OGael" guild and friends on Xat/irc
i myself had around 600 tokens that day, and i'm one of hundreds.

I work with a person who is in charge of some alumni donations for an United States college, they have to maintain the correct paperwork with the legal governing body (ie: IRS for the united states) and that they publicly have to show a certain portion of the donations go to what is said it goes to. However the donations can be used for a wide variety of things that never have to be made public (including special projects and purchases) but does have to be reported to the IRS.

Also, when people talk about having PWO rights, they must remember PWO is not governed by the laws of any single country, most people think PWO falls under the United States laws, which is simply not true. Rights are often set up by a countries government, seeing how PWO isn't controlled by any country really the only right you have in PWO is that you have the right to say 'THE BRITISH ARE COMING THE BRITISH ARE COMING!' Not true because it's in all caps which the gm's will kick you for.

 

[HitmonFonty]

Either way, I think you probably should stop posting on here fonty, no one wants to hear from a mouthpiece who isnt aware of whats going on. All you're doing is further enraging people. "We need a pool of money for server replacements when these become necessary." Like really?

I will not stop posting when posts like this start posting unfounded speculations and rumours that are hurtful to PWO. This post was questions to Bluerise and Xanatus- both of whom have responded- but has also been used as an excuse to post these things as if they are true, the same as many other posts over the last several months.

And the above statement which has been scoffed at is also true. I was here when the current server was bought and Xan has also confirmed plans for a future upgrade.

My opinion on these matters is as valid as anyone else's here. Both as a very long term player and a staff member.

 

[LeroyGarcia]

Alright, I gonna give you some information on how the money is used:

In 2012 i bought 3 super cars because I coudn't decide which whould fit me best so I got a McLaren, Ferrari and Königsegg.
In 2013 I didnt need that much speed anymore, so I wanted to buy an Astion Martin, but I ran out of parking space and so I had to buy myself a castle first to have enough space for upcomming cars.
In 2014 I got sick of cars and thought I gonna get myself an airport build and get my custom aircarfts.
Right now I'm planning to get my own rocket station build for my next vacation on the moon, but I'm still missing a few billions for that, but pwo should get enough donations in 2 or 3 months so I can get it started.

Ok seriously...


PWO's donation aren't any that great that its even worth talking about, but since you guys come up with so many romours, I gonna reply to a few of them.

"PWO made 3k last weekend! I know it!"
Sure, please go ahead and post your proof, because not ever in history of pwo did it make that much of money in such a short period of time.


The money is used for server upkeeping and additional servers when needed, as some are planned for the future.
Server costs are fairly high as we are on an anti-ddos plan for the game server to gaurantee uptime. Bandwidth costs, esspecialy during ddos attacks, are very expensive.
PWO is ran as personal project, so costs can't be reduced from taxes and so the taxes are fairly high as well. There are also conversion and transaction fees from paypal I won't go into details here.

A pool of money is saved for suprisingly high bandwidth costs or other emergency cases such as donation outage or deficencies over some period of time.

Whats left as profit is going to be used for additinal server upgrades. For example we are considering an anti-ddos plan for the webserver if becoming necessary and there are other things you will get announcements soon, considering the future of the project.

PWO money has not been used to buy any cars, houses, or whatever and not been used to finance other games.

For all the lifetime of PWO, it had worked like this and you have to agree we did a good job on it to keep everything running through good and bad times.
This is thanks to you all.

I really don't care what happens to donations as long as part or all of the donations are used to maintain the game just like you said you are doing. I think my point is that we need increased communication between the staff and players. How? Simple, add a Facebook page and/or using the existing twitter account to keep us informed in many things revolving the game. Also involve the community more with making it able for us to share opinions on present and future updates.(with us the players being respectful and understanding of course.)

Time is really not an issue here. If I can have time to use my twitter/Facebook while working and going to school full time, while having routine physical activity and school work, then it should really be no issue. I think this will lessen the tension between staff and players.

Cheers

 

[mad30]

Leroy,

Part of the idea behind revamping of the cg group was what you speak of. The thought process was to better streamline communication to players and have them to focus less on modding and being human wikis.

This has had mixed results. Content wise I think it is working. Outside of that is questionable.

 

[matileo19]

Alright, I gonna give you some information on how the money is used:

I know that this is an ''old'' topic, but seeing the current situation in pwo I'd like to say a few things about Xanatus and Bluerise without making a new topic:

Xanatus:

- You're making a game and there's proof of it, how are you paying to keep it runing while you test and stuff ?
- As some players said, with the Shiny Chance in the TS players expended over 3000 usd in less than a month, and thats a known number, what about the rest of the community? What about the rest of the months and donations? There's more than enough so you should be happy now.
- Considering that you've done nothing to contribute progress on this project and I can confirm it because I've been a part of the staff for 2 years, I'd like to ask you... Why are you still the owner of Pwo? What keeps you here? Hms...
- You've seen Pwo in its last line and you've done nohing, you havent said a single word when it was needed... Why ?

Bluerise:

- The same goes to you, you have been criticized by the whole community because you failed to lead pwo to the way it deserves, you've done promises and yet failed , what are you waiting?
- Pwo decreased its amount of updates and efficiency during your era as leader and you seem to be the only one that can't admit it, may I ask you WHY ?
- Correct me if Im wrong, if Im wrong I'll search your topic (gotta do it now) to take an ss of your comment, you've said to us that you have a family to maintain, but I can see you almost all the time around Pwo... I know this is personal but I wonder how you pretend to maintain a family being a VolUnteEr in a pokemon game. Curious.
- Last thing, I wonder what forces you to stay, even after seeing so many failures, this is just ToOo much stress considering you're a volunteer.

I'm giving you both my personal opinion and this shouldn't be deleted, this isnt off-topic because EVERY question is related to PWO, if you can't understand it then you have a problem, another one... LoL.

Thank you.

 

[Jinji]

Why do people assume that Bluerise "leads" PWO? For that matter, why do people assume that the PWO Staff Structure is such that people within the same ranks are NOT treated as equals and given equal opportunity to raise discussions, make updates within their jurisdiction, or give feedback on the project and one another? Is there any evidence you have to suggest otherwise?

Just to add a point for the record, all Staff members - regardless of rank - are often co-operating with those above them (after all, certain roles may be capable of making improvements those in other roles are not), in order to work on updates TOGETHER - there are very few things being worked on behind the scenes in PWO that are ever under the guidance of just a single person. The current Halloween Event, for example, was a collaboration between many of our Staff Apprentices which also constituted part of their Training; along with GE Staff helping to implement NPCs; and myself and Bluerise adding new items and making changes to the database/server as necessary to support stages of the event, among others.

In my opinion, we are actually more efficient than ever in our development practices; however, it's also true there has been an increased focus on proper quality control over recent months. While this naturally slows down progress to begin with, it also means that things are less likely to require total redevelopment or sudden downtimes to fix embarrassing typos, etc. when they are actually released, speeding us up in the long run because we are not bogged down by the same detail constantly. It's also true that some of our planned updates are being held back pending the release of Hardcoreh's client, which has taken longer than expected due to some real-life issues; but it must be remembered that the PWO Staff are only human and we are dedicating as much to this game as physically possible to get things out at reasonable speeds and in what we believe to be a high standard of quality. In the event you disagree with this, there are many methods available by which you or any other players feeling the same can leave their feedback with us so the matter can be discussed civilly.

 

[Jinga]

It's also true that some of our planned updates are being held back pending the release of Hardcoreh's client, which has taken longer than expected due to some real-life issues; but it must be remembered that the PWO Staff are only human and we are dedicating as much to this game as physically possible to get things out at reasonable speeds and in what we believe to be a high standard of quality. In the event you disagree with this, there are many methods available by which you or any other players feeling the same can leave their feedback with us so the matter can be discussed civilly.

You say real life issues but the former DEV of pwo Shane has created another pokemon mmo client within a week or less so either your DEV is inexperienced or your DEV is lazy to work on something he is volunteering

 

[Jinji]

That's because the client for the other game in question is made simply by modifying code from the existing client he had already made for us. Whereas Hardcoreh is currently working on our new client completely from scratch; and this is naturally a much larger job.

 

[KeyboardWarrior]

"That's because the client for the other game in question is made simply by modifying code from the existing client he had already made for us. Whereas Hardcoreh is currently working on our new client completely from scratch; and this is naturally a much larger job."

Your quote here JJ, is flawed and misguided like all things PWO and staff.

My PRO game is infact a complete rewrite. Uses C#
Where as PWO client uses vb6.

Second of all, the PWO 2.0 was scrapped and you will find the whole backend of this PRO game is completely different.
Hardcore has PWO source, has for along time. All he has to do is port/fix.

Please stop making accusations, all of you. It isn't very nice to lie to your players.
Maybe you are trying to make your selves feel better about your situation. I do not know your motivations to start constant rumors.

But please don't comment on things you have no idea about, that goes for every PWO staff member.

 

[Jinji]

Fair enough, if that is indeed the case - although I'm sure I recall you originally telling me otherwise - then I hold up my hands and agree that I misjudged you and should not have made an incorrect accusation. It is in no way my intention to spread untruths or rumours regarding you Shane - I wouldn't wish to do this to anyone knowingly, since I'm a man of honour and to do such would be against everything I stand for. I just thought I knew more than I obviously did.

Nevertheless, you yourself DENIED us the rights to use the Source Code from your client for PWO, Shane. To say Hardcoreh has it and therefore should be able to port a client easily is a mockery when you already told us we are not permitted to do so.