Slaking with yawn = overrated?

[Siauwlong]

I would like to discuss this topic to all of you guys, u know that slaking is one of the overpowered poke in the pwo, since it could attack without resting like in the original version. With it's very high attack+hp and good def + speed, it was the ultimate killing machine in pwo.

It's always a challenge if your enemies had a slak on his team, but with the right poke, you could counter it (such as chari, arca, meta, steelix, rhydon, jolt, etc)

What makes it difficult to battle against slak is his wide variety of skill (punishment, focus punch, slash are the best 3 moves it has)
- Punishment could kill dark poke like kazam, gengar, eggs, and starmie easily (in the old days slak only have faint attack, so starmie could be a good counter against slaking if hydro doesn't miss) and sometimes strong slak could win against meta with this move
- Focus punch very useful against steel + rock poke, so strong slak could defeat rhydon, steelix, golem, ttar, and other that weak against fighting move as well
- Slash is widely use move for any poke that get hit 100% by normal moves

With this 3 moves, slaking is already powerful, but when there's yawn , slak become more powerful than ever...

Imagine this, if you have 1 poke's left in ur team which is slaking, and the enemy maybe has 3 left (eggs, meta, feral)
- Slaking kill eggs with 2x punishment, eggs damage half of the slaking's hp with leaf storm
- meta sent out, slaking use yawn on meta and meta sleep for 3 turns, so slaking could kill it
- feral was sent out last, and slak use yawn, and the feral sleep again for 2 turns, and slaking kills it

suddenly the one who we think will lose win the battle , i know everything is based on our luck, but don't you just upset when this happen?

I just wanna see the pro and con here, please feel free to say ur argument guys

 

[danhlk]

we are not sure about yawn...sometime the enemy sleep for 2,3 turn and sometime it wake up immediately

 

[Siauwlong]

yep, just in case it sleep like that..

 

[HeavyPetter]

I like the idea of introducing more move effects to the "metagame", but I agree with Siauwlong that Slaking is probably the one pokémon who shouldn't keep getting buffed.

 

[Nikola]

Yawn is totally something that slaking shouldn't have. I am not using that move in most cases but others are. Slaking is good with those 3 moves mentioned above. I am fan of a Slak and I felt kinda bad when Hammer Arm/Reversal got deleted. And yawn is a probably "worse" move then those. Even with counters such as metagross, steelix and rhydon yawn can do a same thing as hammer arm. Only one turn of sleeping is enough that Slahking kills those 3. Confuse ray was nerfed but it wasn't causing troubles like yawn is. Its not good to see that someone is overusing yawn instead of slash or any other move on Slaking.

 

[fableboy]

ya its a good topic and im in a favor of slaking not having yarn even if its not the case betweed slak and meta or slak and fera if its the case with 2 slakings
1 weak 1 strong and if the strong one attacks with slash and the weak one sleeps for 2 or more turns then weaker slak will win(unfair to the stronger slaking)

 

[matileo19]

Slaking*... is overrated and overpowerful. Slaking will stay being a ''King'' because it has the same stats as a Legendary pokemon...

 

[CoolKnightST]

I don't think yawn remove is an good idea but an nerf on the move would maybe be something (like reducing the chance to turn pokémon in the sleep status). During an lot attack are broken it's not easy to encounter slaking and probaly will remain one of the most powerfull pokémons in the game for now. Since slaking has not an lot of moves against ghost I think he probaly will do fine for now.

 

[Siauwlong]

against ghost? punishment will kill any ghost poke maybe with 1 hit...

 

[Saric]

I don't think yawn remove is an good idea but an nerf on the move would maybe be something (like reducing the chance to turn pokémon in the sleep status). During an lot attack are broken it's not easy to encounter slaking and probaly will remain one of the most powerfull pokémons in the game for now. Since slaking has not an lot of moves against ghost I think he probaly will do fine for now.

Punishment murders any ghost type.
Slaking can pretty much beat anything right now that doesn't have high defense and hp or resists normal/dark, or a poke that doesn't out-speed it and being able to utilize special attacks (such as jolt, which I believe is the only viable one)

 

[CoolKnightST]

Maybe an nerf on his speed.

 

[Naero]

Maybe an nerf on his speed.

The problem with altering its base-stats would be that veekun.com would miscalculate its IVs, since veekun.com stores the same base stat values used in the handheld games for its calculations. It may not be the case for a more custom IV calculator, however.

Nerfing its base speed would empower more strong special attackers to counter Slaking, if they could outspeed it. However, I believe it's intended for the base stats of all Pokemon to be aligned with those in the handheld games, so I can't see it happening. Nonetheless, it would be nice to see more countermeasures being made against Slaking, or to least avoid buffing Slaking further until its ability in Truant is added.

 

[Nikola]

Don't even think about it.

 

[CoolKnightST]

Another option maybe is lower is loyalty. I'm not sure it's in the game yet but in the original game pokémon sometimes ignore commands (mostly when they where trade). If this can be lowered it would be harder for players to held slaking. I only fear this is not implement yet. (not sure if loyalty is the happyness)

 

[Naero]

Another option maybe is lower is loyalty. I'm not sure it's in the game yet but in the original game pokémon sometimes ignore commands (mostly when they where trade). If this can be lowered it would be harder for players to held slaking. I only fear this is not implement yet. (not sure if loyalty is the happyness)

Obedience is the system you're referring to, which determined whether a Pokemon would refuse or obey a trainer's commands, depending on how many badges a player has obtained.

Happiness is a different system; it determined how much a Pokemon enjoyed being under the ownership of a trainer, but regardless of the happiness meter, a Pokemon would still remain loyal to their trainer provided that they obtained the required badges.

However, on-point: implementing an obedience system would most likely not impede an onslaught from Slaking. All prominent pvp players - who sport full-fledged team of Pokemon in their 90s - have already obtained all of the badges, or are in a viable position to obtain those badges, thus this system would be effectually out of the picture for the prevalence of Slaking in pvp; disobedient Slakings, or Pokemon in general, would be kept to a minimum - if at all - in the pvp scene. The pvp scene pre-dominantly consists of players who would not be hindered by disobedience, which is where Slaking's OP stature is really sparking concern.

 

[Jinji]

Loyalty and Happiness are two words for the same concept. However, neither are related to whether your Pokémon obeys orders or not. This is a separate mechanic, which has no actual name but is commonly termed Obedience.

Obedience isn't a defined quantity in Pokémon games. Pokémon are disobedient only if you do not have the requirements to be training them at the level they are; and whether they follow your orders or not is based on a random chance. By default in Pokémon games, any Pokémon over Level 10 will disobey you if you do not possess any badges; this limit is increased as badges are amassed. These limits apply mostly only to Pokémon acquired in a trade.

Neither mechanic exists in PWO yet; but I would not be surprised to see the disobey mechanic in a future edition of the game. Note this is my opinion and should not be taken as a statement of intent - to my knowledge, plans have not been discussed for many of the finer game mechanics at this time.

 

[seapig]

The counter to powerful moves is supposed to be PP. It has not been instituted yet, I presume, because it is a difficult thing to program in. The problem is most players object to PP because "I don't want to have to go to the pokecenter for that," "I want to spam Hyper Beam over and over," "I want to only have the strongest moves," "I don't want to have two moves of the same type," "I don't want to have to think," "wah, wah, wah," "cry, cry cry," "whine, whine, whine," etc, etc, etc. PP is as big a part of Pokemon as type advantages. Without it, playing the game is a joke. It would be like playing a first-person shooter with no ammo. Once you get a missile launcher, you can ditch the lame 10mm pistol. Just blow everything to kingdom come! You're a god! Hahahaha!

Then there's pokemon like Slaking. It is one of a select group of pokemon that are generally more powerful than others. You mentioned a few that can stand up to it. But those pokes are also overpowered. This is true to the point that if you play PWO long enough, you either have these overpowered pokes or you don't. If you don't, you suck. Pure and simple. I would personally rather suck and have it more interesting than have a carbon copy lineup that 300 other people have. But that's just the way they are. Those are the stats and it's something that can't be changed because it would be deviating from the real games. They could make these superpokemon more rare, perhaps. Remove them from the token store. Things like that. The fact is that if your opponent has Slaking, the only possible counter is one of the other supers. So...what's the point?

Getting back to my first statement, they need to integrate PP. There are a lot of things that need to be added and/or updated. I'm not rushing the staff about it. I understand that it takes time and work and so forth. But eventually, it needs to happen. The more moves that are added, the more affects that come into play, everything like that will help balance the game. Even things like natures will help. The right way to play pokemon should be to use your head. To use strategy. It shouldn't be as simple as "My pokemon has higher attack and Yawn so it will win." Of all of the things that need updating, I would say PP should be the top priority.

 

[Jinji]

PP is something we want to look into implementing in the planned future overhaul of the battle system. It should be noted that the functionality already exists, but the current system does not make actual use of it (I have never been sure of the reasons for this, but it may have been related to early client bugs).

 

[ZedgaGhost]

Yawn is totally something that slaking shouldn't have. I am not using that move in most cases but others are. Slaking is good with those 3 moves mentioned above. I am fan of a Slak and I felt kinda bad when Hammer Arm/Reversal got deleted. And yawn is a probably "worse" move then those. Even with counters such as metagross, steelix and rhydon yawn can do a same thing as hammer arm. Only one turn of sleeping is enough that Slahking kills those 3. Confuse ray was nerfed but it wasn't causing troubles like yawn is. Its not good to see that someone is overusing yawn instead of slash or any other move on Slaking.

I am agree to Darcia!

 

[Siauwlong]

still with PP, if slaking has yawn, he'll use it... whats the solution on that?